Once in a while, I tune into KJSL, a St. Louis Christian talk radio station. I do this as part of a conscious effort to make myself listen to people with views that are dramatically different from my own. Perhaps I will understand those views better if I take the time to listen more.
While I was driving last week, the station featured a show called “News and Views,” hosted by a man named “Dr. Larry Bates.” The host repeatedly painted the future of the US as bleak, thanks to irresponsible financial policies by the federal government. Because I have some sympathy with that general conclusion, I continued to listen. It turned out that Bates was predicting the imminent financial collapse of the United States. Although I doubted that conclusion, I continued to listen.
Bates then indicated that he is also a big proponent of religious “End Times.” In short, he believes that Jesus will soon be returning to Earth in order to sort things out. I have no sympathy for this religious view. In fact, I find End Times beliefs to be irresponsible and destructive for the numerous reasons. For example, I do not hold the Bible to be inerrant. Based on my study of the Bible, although it offers some good stories and some reasonable moral instruction, it is also rife with bad advice, contradictions and senseless violence.
“Dr. Larry Bates” wears many hats. He claims to be an economist, publisher, editor, former member of the Tennessee House of Representatives, former bank CEO and a “nationally recognized expert on political systems and the Federal Reserve.” Bates is also the President of First American Monetary Consultants, Inc. (FAMC), an organization that allegedly does “economic and market forecasting, in addition to offering a wide variety of other End Times services. “News and Views” is a syndicated radio show, available dozens of radio stations across the U.S. Larry Bates is thus well known in some circles.
After listening to Bates for only a few minutes, I learned that the United States needs to immediately and mercilessly bomb Iran because of what “those people” have done to “support terrorism.” I also learned that we need to support Israel without question, based upon what the Bible says. I persevered to the end of the show, saddened by and frustrated with the flimsy manner in which Bates attempted to support his conclusions.
At the end of the show, it was announced that Bates was going to be featured at a half-day conference in St. Louis, I took the bait. I thought it would be interesting to better understand the basis for the views of End Times (both economic End Times and religious End Times) proponents. The conference was called “Perilous Times: Significant End Time Events.” I paid $20 and showed up at the Crystal Ballroom of the Renaissance St. Louis Grand and Suites Hotel in downtown St. Louis. Here’s my ticket:
At the registration desk, I received a folder full of information. One of the pamphlets advised me that legalized gay marriage is a major obstacle to democracy:
When the US Supreme Court ruled in Lawrence v. Texas last year that sodomy is a constitutional ‘right,’ the director of the lambda legal fund-a radical homosexual-agenda of pressure group-gleefully explained that this marks the beginning of the end to traditional marriage.
Another pamphlet advised that the United States is officially a Judeo-Christian nation. It quoted William Penn: “Those people who will not be governed by God will be ruled by tyrants.” This pamphlet, printed by FAMC, “proves” that the United States is a Christian nation based upon the fact that the Constitutions of many of the states mention “God,” or “the Creator.” As though non-Christian religions don’t believe in a “God” or a “Creator.”
There were numerous products displayed and advertised at the conference. These products are the sorts of things you’ll need to have if you are going to be prepared for the economic and religious End Times. If you want to prevent cancer, you need to load up on Glutathione. The pamphlet says “your life depends on Glutathione.” To buy it, contact FAMC, according to the pamphlet.
What if you just want to make sure that you have access to “the most universal antibiotic” known to man, colloidal silver? It’s a “tasteless, odorless, non-toxic, purer, natural substance consisting of submicroscopic clusters of silver particles suspended by a tiny electric charge placed on each particle.” According to the pamphlet, you drink it. It kills all those pesky pathogens and protects all your good cells. According to the pamphlet, it is useful for treating allergies, boils, herpes, stomach flu, lime disease, gonorrhea, bladder irritations and chickenpox. The list goes on and on. Colloidal silver can be used vaginally, anally or dropped into the eyes.” You can even make your own colloidal silver out of silver wire, using the $189 generator you can buy from FAMC.
Another pamphlet advised me of my right to participate in jury nullification whenever anyone is being prosecuted for a gun crime. That is because “corrupted, anti-gun prosecutors and judges are common.” This information is distributed by the Fully Informed Jury Association.
After the economic collapse, you’ll need to make better use of all that expensive gasoline that all of us are going to need. Therefore, make sure you buy the “Power Plus Mpg” additive. Using this Power Plus, you can save 25 to $.50 per gallon. During his talk (which I’ll discuss in detail further down), Larry Bates bragged that his 5 mpg SUV improved its mileage 50% (to 7.5 mpg) after he started using this Power Plus. Those attending the conference were even invited to sign up as Power Plus distributors.
Additional Pamphlets were available advising how to support efforts to find those “30,000 POWs [who] were known to be behind alive after WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Persian Gulf and War on Terror.” There was also a table full of conservative-message bumper stickers.
The nice old fellow minding that table offered me a chance to take any one of those bumper stickers for free. I really struggled to find anything that didn’t offend my politics (maybe I am a liberal). After searching for a full minute, I picked up Smoke – Choke – Stroke – Croak.
I wasn’t really at the conference to dwell on the End Times products, however. I was there to listen to “Dr. Larry Bates,” just like the 200 other people who attended. Although the crowd included a handful of young adults, most of those attending were in their 60s or 70s. As is often the case with groups of conservative Christians, this was an extremely polite and orderly group. People held doors for each other and took time to exchange pleasantries.
Dr. Larry Bates introduced himself and then introduced a local preacher who opened the meeting with a prayer. Almost everyone bowed their heads respectfully. Then it was time to offer a few door prizes. The winners had a choice of two books: The Coming Financial Wipeout or America’s Christian Heritage.
Then it was time for four-hours of lecture. Bates bemoaned the lack of pastors in the audience. He complained that too many church leaders were “eating the sheep rather than feeding the sheep.” He asked for a show of hands of those who believe that we were in the last days, and perhaps a third of the audience raised their hand. When he asked whether we were in the very last days, 15% raised their hands.
Bates informed the audience that their job was to “raise up wisdom.” This has to be done by taking back the media, he explained, although “Fox news is one of our best news channels.”
He explained that the next election is the most important one ever. It will be about “class warfare.” The election whether we’ll have less government and bigger government. It’s between monopolistic versus competitive capitalism. Although the Republicans are imperfect, according to a distressed Bates, the only real choice in this upcoming election is Republican. More on this further down.
The United States is under attack by economic and political elitists who want to keep the middle class trapped as pawns and serfs in this elitist version of a caste system. These are desperate times, because “There are only two countries in the entire world where the middle class runs the government or has the opportunity to run the government: the United States and Israel.”
The elitists are “One World Socialists” according to Bates. They want to level everyone out to make everyone equally poor, except for themselves. A repeated target of Bates was the Federal Reserve, which “only looks federal and has no reserves.” Bates could barely contain his scorn for the Federal Reserve, which, he repeatedly emphasized, was totally owned by private bankers.
Bates is highly suspicious of George W. Bush’s “New World order.” It is a conspiracy against the people of the United States, and it amounts to “one world socialism,” an attempt to make everyone poor except for an elite ruling class. He exhorted that the creation of the Federal Reserve was a conspiracy to rob the American middle class. The Federal Reserve is a “criminal syndicate.” According to Bates, the head of the Federal Reserve is more powerful than the president of the United States. In all earnestness, he told the crowd that the 1938 panic-provoking radio adaptation of “War of the Worlds” was not entertainment. It was a test by the government elite to see if the federal government could maintain control over the New World Order.
What are the elitists trying to do? They are trying to create a North American Union. They want to merge the United States, Mexico and Canada and to destroy the sovereignty of the United States. That’s why we have a lax immigration policy, he warned. What’s the solution? “Build a fence and keep them out.” If the rate of immigration exceeds your rate of assimilation, “you lose your country.” Throughout his talk, Bates insinuated that the impending economic collapse will coincide with the religious Second Coming.
The Democrats are the party of big government, militant homosexual “rights and domination.” The Democrats are Socialists, from the party of Karl Marx, where the government owns and controls everything, including all means of distribution and production. “Liberals hate property rights.” Bates drew numerous parallels to the Soviet Union, where people had to wait in long lines for everything. That’s what the Democrats would bring us, he urged.
He warned that you can’t overlook the Republicans just because are imperfect. He understands that “Jesus Christ is not on the ballot.” If you hurt the Republicans, “you hurt yourself.” “Dingy Harry Reid “is corrupt and Nancy Pelosi is “a disaster.” Whenever you have a strong economy, you’ve got limited government. “It’s that simple.” Are there any litmus test for politicians? Absolutely. Don’t vote for anybody who believes in any right to abortion. “Nothing tells you more about politicians that sanctity of life. If they don’t get this right, they get nothing right.”
What else did he think about some the candidates? There was no holding back. Hillary Clinton shouldn’t be president because God has a natural order for things. Bates paused to caution the audience, “I’m not a chauvinist.” Then he forged on: “God is the head of man and man is the head of women. A two-headed family is a freak.” He offered this evidence of his position: Indonesia is struggling because it is a matriarchy. To allow women to run the country is to violate God’s order. God says there should not be a woman president. It is as aberrant as “letting children run a household.”
According to Bates, “Barack Hussein Obama” (he repeated this full name several times) is a radical muslim who was educated in a radical muslim school. His Church is full of people who, according to Bates, hate white people. [For those who are concerned about Obama based on Bates’ outrageous claims, check out this and this].
Are there some good Republican candidates? You bet, according to Bates. For instance, Tom Tancredo got it right when he recently got tough with Muslims. Bates described it like this: “if you use a nuclear device in the United States, then we will use a nuke to take out Mecca and Medina . . . [applause] . . . Brutal force is the only thing these birds understand.” Upon hearing and seeing this, I was stunned. Though I tried, I couldn’t recall the particular verse of the Bible where Jesus said, “If someone shits on you, shit on them.”
But Bates wasn’t done with the Muslims. According to Bates, the goal of Islam is “world domination under sharia law.” There are three types of followers of Islam, according to Bates. Type 1 is a revolutionary who sets off bombs. These people are terrorists. The second type is an evolutionary follower, distributing propaganda and prolifically “breeding.” The third type is a westernized Muslim who probably hasn’t even read the Koran. Nonetheless, those westernized Muslims will fall right in line, especially when those other Muslims threaten to cut off their heads or attack members of their families. The Koran “tells you “to kill and who to kill,” according to Bates. It tells you to kill Christians and Jews.
According to Bates, Sam Brownback of Kansas is misguided (too liberal) on immigration, perhaps because of his Catholic conversion. He doesn’t understand that we’ve simply got to keep those immigrants out.
What are some of the big issues of the upcoming election? National health insurance is a big issue. If we have national health insurance, it will “ruin the country. The country ends when we enact national health insurance.” What’s the evidence for this dramatic prediction? Tennessee has free government medical care, yet (according to Bates) nobody signs up for it. Therefore, there’s no need for national health insurance. Under national health insurance, Bill Clinton would have had to wait six weeks to get an appointment and six months to get his necessary surgery. National health insurance involves the “efficiency of the post office and the compassion of the IRS.” Furthermore, it will “drive the cost of health care way up.” National healthcare will bankrupt the country: “The government that can give you everything you want must, by definition, take everything you’ve got.”
Bates warns that people need to quit concerning themselves with the healthcare establishment. In fact, he’s suspicious of the healthcare system. People need to focus on preventing disease rather than treating it. They need a laugh more. “Laughter is better medicine.” People would “rather be victims-our diseases are other people’s faults.” People need to take responsibility for their own good health, said Bates, who looks to be a few pounds overweight. It all starts “with what you put in your body.” Bates then spent a serious chunk of time touting the healthcare products displayed on the tables in the lobby.
Bates explained that churches will need to get more into the healthcare business, because they have more to offer than the healthcare establishment. Churches have the courage to “tell the bums that they are bums” (I wondered what the bum lobby would think of this statement.
We have too much Blue Cross and Blue Shield. We depend too much on man and not enough on God. We’ve replaced God on the throne with government on the throne. We look to Jehovah government instead of God.
Bates announced that if anyone gets sick, it’s that person’s own fault. There are plenty of things you can do so that you don’t get sick, according to Bates. You can take regular doses of that colloidal silver I first learned about from the handouts. He announced that colloidal silver kills all bacteria. Someone in the back of the room then announced “Amen!” Gee, Larry, I wondered. Are you sure you want to kill all the bacteria in your body, including the beneficial bacteria that reside in your gut? He marched on, undeterred. Bates claims that he puts silver in his milk to keep it from spoiling. It will never spoil as long as you put silver in your carton of milk. He urged the audience to buy the colloidal silver generating kit, so they can make their own colloidal silver. He warned the audience that the FDA does not want people to know about the amazing healing powers of silver. The FDA doesn’t want the competition—it would put some big pharmaceutical companies out of business. In fact, the FDA is about to try to outlaw the use of silver as a medicine. Modern pharmaceuticals are “witchcraft.”
What else can you do to stay healthy? If you’ve got cancer, make sure you consider getting vitamin C injections. These have been phenomenally successful, according to Bates. This new knowledge about the healing powers of vitamin C reminded him that the Bible predicted “God’s plan of healing.” This kind of “new important knowledge” is another sign of “the last days.” We need to be the “salt” (disinfectant of the evil people) and the “light” (spreading wisdom). Bates warned that many believers are going to have to do God’s work on their own because churches “have been corrupted by world government.”
What would you do if you’re laid-off in the impending economic collapse? You need to get a trade. You need to do something with your hands, such as plumbing or electrical work. “The time will come when you have to barter your skills for someone else’s skills.” The End Times are apparently not going to be pretty.
The last section of the presentation was an indictment of US monetary policy. Bates pointed out that the United States now has $25 trillion in domestic debt which must be serviced, whereas the M2 money supply is only $7 trillion. This sets the stage for the economic End Times. The government can either go into default work or print fake money to dilute real wealth. He warns that the U.S. is busy printing lots of fake money. That’s what the recent $300 billion injection of “new money” was. It was used to allegedly stabilize the stock market. He warns that it would take a 7.1% added payroll tax to service our current debt, an amount that would break the backs of most families. Bates sees a massive restructuring of the social security system forthcoming, including raised taxes and reduced benefits, as well as means tests.
What can we do about the impending economic collapse? One thing is that we can make sure that no one takes away our guns, said Bates.
There will be no total economic collapse until there is total gun control. The tyrants don’t want to deal with an armed populace. The enemies of liberty hate your guns. The Second Amendment protects the First Amendment.
Here’s what else you can do, according to Bates. Elect people who will build fences to keep out the immigrants. Hone your communications skills, because the upcoming wars will be wars of world views. According to the Bible, “when you see the enemy, you’ll need to warn the city.”
As far as protecting your assets, Bates gives this advice: Stay away from “Loanership” assets, such as Money Market funds, T-bills and CD’s. They are “pieces of paper: IOU’s. Beware of real estate, in this age when the government is taxing it heavily and abusing eminent domain. Instead, load up on precious metals, such as gold and silver coins. This is especially important, given that the U.S. has long been off the gold standard, which has invited the dollar’s slide versus most currencies. He claims that you should not get gold or silver bullion because federal law gives the government the right to confiscate these in times of economic emergency.
Who’s going to buy your precious metal coins in the time of economic collapse? Bates is convincing to me when he answers that question with another question: “Who is going to buy your paper dollars?” He characterizes gold and silver as “money.” Everything else is only “credit.”
So Bates’ program includes both saving and eating silver! Where are you going to get all of those precious metals? From a reputable company like FAMC, of course. Bates tells you to buy precious coins and his company is happy to sell them to you. He told the crowd that precious metal coins are “real money” and that they will be exchangeable until the absolute end of time. Didn’t the Bible say that people will throw their gold and silver into the street? Absolutely, says Bates. But that will be toward the end, when we’ll see a “large scale transfer of wealth from the wicked to the righteous.” It’s all in the Bible, according to Bates. Up until those End Times, then, rely on precious metals, says Bates, citing Ezekiel 7:19 (“Precious metals very valuable until the time that God’s wrath is poured out”) and Haggai 2:6-9 (End time transfer of wealth using precious metals”).
Bates is not embarrassed about having money. “God doesn’t mind if you have nice things.” You should use and enjoy your money, he stresses. Have as much of it as you need, even if you use it to buy expensive houses, cars and vacations. No problem. It’s only the “love of money” that is the root of all evil. His literature cites Proverbs 28:20 (“Eager to get rich; will not go unpunished”), Ecclesiastes 2:26 (“One who pleases Him receives wealth”) and Genesis 2:11-12 (“God put gold in the earth for a reason”).
—
It’s hard to know how to sum up this Perilous Times Conference. The lessons taught by Bates are laced with radical conservative values, that is true. His characterizations of both Republicans and Democrats are cartoonish. His xenophobia and racism (especially toward women and people from the Middle East) are intense. His plan to capitalize upon the fears he drums up, both economic and religious, is predictable and obvious.
Bates has a ready and willing audience, because his targets are big and fat. Anyone with energy and creativity can vigorously hack away at pharmaceutical companies, drug companies, bankers, politicians and bureaucrats. If you can convince your audience that it might lose much of what it has worked for, you could readily stir up their deep fears about out-groups such as gays, women, atheists and immigrants.
Bates is playing a game that is played by many people who have some legitimate credentials. During the final portion of this conference Bates sometimes sounded like someone who was giving some reasonable economic advice based on sophisticated training. He sometimes spoke as person who relied on his training and experience in economics and banking. I am not an economist or a banker, and I have not read nearly enough to know the extent to which Bates is giving decent economic advice, though what I have read about United States fiscal policy also concerns me greatly. I’ve seen similar admonitions regarding the United States fiscal policy on “liberal” shows such as Bill Moyers. I think it is this part of the show that gives Bates the foot in the door with his audience.
Nonetheless, it is a standard trick to parlay one’s legitimate credentials far beyond the realm of one’s expertise. When Bates talks with ultra-assurance of the alleged Second Coming of Christ or when he touts the medical quackery he is so happy to peddle, he looks both naïve and devious. Shame on his audience members, though, if they really step up to buy that little bottle of fuel additive that will allegedly make their humongous SUVs get 50% better gas mileage. Shame on the people who think that the FDA is trying to outlaw silver potions because drinkable silver is so incredibly good that it would put pharmaceutical companies out of business. Shame on people who trust people who sell snake oil.
I couldn’t help but conclude that there is much in common among the sorts of people that listen to Bates and the sorts of people with whom I more commonly associate. We are all worried about our corrupt government, our poisoned food and water, our shortsighted fiscal policies, our many failing schools, our own deaths, about numerous people illegally pouring over our borders, about the many people who are addicted to drugs and alcohol and about a media with an agenda secretly dictated by those who hold disproportionate power. Many Believers and non-Believers are downright suspicious of organized religions. We differ profoundly, however, in the ways in which we would address these threats. What Bates offers is a bomb-shelter mentality. He relentlessly warns his audience of the need to hunker down and protect one’s own and let everyone else be damned.
As I left Perilous Times Conference, I wondered whether it would be an impossible task to convince the people in that audience to put down their Bibles and roll up their sleeves when they discuss politics. I wondered whether these people would ever be willing to open their minds to diverse ideas from people who might look and act differently than they do. I wondered whether Bates’ fans would ever be willing to look at their own cherished ideas as skeptically as they look at the ideas of others. I wondered whether they would ever be capable of pretending, even for a moment, that they were not under attack by all of those people of the world who they don’t know well. I wondered whether they could ever be convinced to consider that strangers are, for the most part, people with hopes, dreams and fears much like their own.
After mega-doses of Larry Bates, is it even possible for people to consider that there is a vast commonality all people share and that this could really be a starting point for a functional world view, one that is not based on paranoia?
Rob,
The quotes I offered reflect the attitude many of the Founders had toward churches and priests and if you dig further you will find that they approached the task of building a state with an attitude that, even while many of them held deep spiritual beliefs, basing a political system on such beliefs was to inevitably bring on many if not most of the problems they were trying to break away from. So they constructed a system wherein you and I can have completely different opinions about the nature of god and religion and still be regarded as equally valuable in the eyes of the law. For that to happen, the state must not take sides, must in fact be based on something other than the faith they were trying to defend. Andrew Jackson notwithstanding (and that is one more indication that he was not the brilliant thinker most people seem to think he was), when you look at the founding documents it is clear that this nation is based on a disinterested framework in which religion is merely one aspect of a complex stew. How anyone can read the constitution and think for a minute that it has a biblical foundation is beyond me.
The Bible is nowhere about freedom. It is a document in support of an intolerant theocracy. Obedience is the watchword and an abandonment of personal freedom is the sign of the faithful. People have remade the Bible in their imagination to support what they want or believe at the moment—"I am a Christian and I want political freedom, therefore the book upon which my christianity is based must also be about political freedom, a book I haven't actually read…"
Like it or not, running a set of laws based on what people believe that cannot be proven in court is the road to tyranny, as has been demonstrated again and again and again. If you condemn someone based on what they believe (as happens in all religiously based polities) to violate every principle enshrined in the Constitution. How I pray (or not) must make no difference with respect to my position as a citizen.
You cannot run a government based on prophecy. All you can do is abandon any attempt to run it, and that leads to chaos—which is where most prophecy leads anyway, so I suppose it would be self-fulfilling.
Mark: I think that your point ("The Bible is nowhere about freedom. It is a document in support of an intolerant theocracy") is well worth noting. There is not much about our fledgling country that was based on any Biblical passage, especially the central idea that the rules should emanate from those who are subjected to the rules. I.E., we don't recognize the right of outside authority to impose restrictions or threats upon us. That principle is (as you point out) antithetical to most of what you will read in the Bible.
Liberals always want references when views oppose their own. Isaiah 53 foretells the coming Saviour. Psalm 22 describes the crucification. Daniel, prophesied the timing of Jesus. He also prophesied the SUCCESSION of the world empires and the rise of certain kings, before their rise and fall. Ezekiel 37:21 prophesied the return of Israel as a nation, which happened in 1948. Most profound proof is the Jews themselves. After everything they've been through, They still exist as a nation surrounded by enemies and many who've tried to wipe them out. Why? read Jeremiah 31:35-36. Never again will they cease to exist. Oh, and Mr. Tiedemann, your right, you should save your knees, you will need them later. "For it is written, every knee shall bow and every tongue confess to God". Even a long winded tongue such as yours. Anyone interesed go onto David Barton's website (will put these ameteurs to shame).
Rob,
I would hope conservatives require references as well. So you were in error claiming Isaiah prophesied all this. It's in various places.
Amateurs. Hmm. Since you have no idea who we are, that's presumptuous. Still, in my case, I'll cop to it. But that's no criticism. Even an amateur can do research and study and draw conclusions.
Daniel is a poor resource. It was cobbled together from at least three sources and even its internal chronology is error-filled (The first few verses, which are supposed to serve notice as to when this takes place, are at least ten years off the mark).
But ultimately, all this prophesying is for naught, since the last prophecy—the return of Yeshua, made by the man himself—turned out to be false. He told the disciples he'd come back before they (their generation) had passed from the earth. In other words, in their lifetime.
We're all still waiting.
Oops. Got that wrong.
Now, I understand the desire to hold some form of special knowledge against those with whom you would like to feel superior, and the bible provides a lot of it. But when you make arguments about matters that can be checked, handwaving and mystical cant only serve to make you look silly. The simple fact is that much of the bible has been added to and modified over time by people whose names we'll never know but whose intentions were clear—to make the bible conform to expectation.
Contrariwise—what started this whole thing—the documents of the Founding Fathers are intact. We have the originals (we do not have the originals for any of the books of the bible). We can look at what they said, publicly and to each other.
So when people claim that this country was founded on biblical principle, one can go look and read and see that this is blatantly false.
My apologies if you find my tongue longwinded (mixing metaphors as well), but I like to be clear when I explain why I consider something complete nonsense.
Oh, and Rob….
I am familiar with Barton's work. It is not to be trusted. He has made a number of claims that can't be backed up by original documents. (One quote in particular he attributed to Madison is not to be found anywhere in Madison's writings.) He seems to pursue wishfulfillment as a historical process. Again, not a good choice to make legitimizing claims.
But based on this, he would be ideal for inclusion in an updated version of the bible.
So if Bates published his book in 1994 foretelling the current economic crisis, he must have magical psychic powers granted to be by an omnipotent spirit.. ( You must have been smoking some of that extra potent Canadian weed)
Back in 1990, the movie "Prayer of the Rollerboys" was released.
In the movie, set in a near future, the country experiences a complete financial breakdown caused by too much bad debt. (Sounds familiar!) When the economy collapsed, people lost their job, their farms, and their homes.
The story is set in Los Angeles, where high unemployment and homelessness has created a violent, crime -riddled culture. Out of this culture arises The Rollerboys, a rollerblading white supremacist gang with with their own secret plan to rid the nation of the "undesirable", mostly non-Caucasian segment of the population, representing the foreign corporations which have taken control of the country.
Much of the film is eerily predictive of our current economic woes. Perhaps Mr Bates was inspired by the film or possibly by the trailers for the film into writing his book.
The point I'm making here is that Bates was one of many writers who recognized the historical patterns of the economic rise before the fall, and there were many books and films written forecasting similar results, all symptoms of past economic crashes.
Bates, however, used his economic forecast as a way to worm his way into the bank accounts of the religious. He is a part of the problem, one of the symptoms, a shyster and con man, but most certainly not the great prophet he proclaims himself to be.
Mr Tiedemann, I see that from one of your more recent posts, your pride swelled up inside you and overflowed so much to the point where you had to blurt out in writing "you have no idea who we are". Are you someone really great? Well, good for you. I do think that if you keep writing these long winded, ranting, arrogant postings, you just might become our next President. You're just sore that Larry Bates is selling more books than you.
Samantha: I will be presumptuous and say something on behalf of Mark. He has written numerous thoughtful posts at this site. You would be too quick to judge him to the extent that you haven't read any of his other work. Second, he happens to be a well-published science fiction writer. None of this, in and of itself, means that he is correct and you are incorrect on any particular issue. But it should give you pause before making the assumption that you can quickly pigeon-hole him.
Samantha writes:—"your pride swelled up inside you and overflowed so much to the point where you had to blurt out in writing “you have no idea who we are”. Are you someone really great?"
Greatness is no guarantee against foolishness. You have no idea who we are exactly as we have no idea who you are. Are you someone great?
Does one have to be "someone great" in order to recognize nonsense for what it is?
What you saw as pride was merely a statement of fact. That you took it as an expression of pride pretty much demonstrates the point of my remark, which of course was in response to one of your judgmental remarks.
Yes, Mr. Bates doubtless sells many more books than I do. Mr. Barnum sold a lot more tickets than lecturers on rational topics did. Reason isn't very sexy…and it's hard work.
But the payoff is a lot more satisfying. Instead of sneering at me, why not crack a book on economics and learn something real?
Mea culpa. My response concerning not knowing who we are was not made to Samantha, but to Rob. My apologies.
Still, since you two seem to be posting in tandem…
I note that, Samantha, you elected not to respond to a single counter example I gave. Where Rob disdains Liberals for wanting references (again, there's that presumption that he knows something about us—someone disagrees with your position they are automatically a Liberal?), I could as easily say that neocons and fundies always ignore references in favor of their own delusions.
Nor are you especially true to your word. On August 13th, Samantha wrote: "This is the last comment I will make."
Thus begins the battle between integrity and pride . . . and only time will tell whether Samantha will return to comment again.
I'M SO GLAD I FOUND YOU! WILL PASTOR SOLOMON WHITMAN BE SPEAKING IN ONE OF YOUR MEETINGS SOON? WE MISS HEARING HIS INSIGHTFUL THOUGHTS ON AMERICA. PLEASE…PLEASE…PLEASE!
SUE: I'm glad that you're glad, but I suspect that you think that you're writing to Larry Bates. But Larry is not here . . . Nor will I try to sell you gold coins, silver medicine or anything else!
Correct!! I did write that I would not write again. Had to. Rob was at work. But, Mr Tiedemann already gave it away from the first paragraph from his August 14th post. Anyway, just a question. If Mr Tiedemann is a science fiction author, is it presumptuous to assume that he is an "amateur" as far as American History and the Bible are concerned, since that was the topic on the table? Why would he be an "expert" on all subjects because he is a science fiction author? Many professions require the use of referencing. If I were a neuro-science nurse and someone called me an amateur as far as diabetes was concerned, would not be offended at all.
I'm sorry, I can't resist. Mr Tiedemann writes science fiction books and tells me to "buy a book on economics and learn something real". Does anyone else see the irony in this. But, I did receive Larry Bates new book and started reading it last night. Mr Tiedemann and Erich, you probably don't care, but I will pray for you. I really do want you both to be successful. Claiming to be a "Christian" without Christ just won't work. I don't believe it was an accident that I stumbled across this website. That's why I feel compelled to pray for you. Let's see if it makes a difference in your life.
Samantha – thank you for your well wishes. I understand them in a way different than you, but I recognize your kindness in writing what you have written. http://dangerousintersection.org/2010/07/14/mendi…
Samantha writes:—"I’m sorry, I can’t resist. Mr Tiedemann writes science fiction books and tells me to “buy a book on economics and learn something real”. Does anyone else see the irony in this."
I know, on the surface it would seem to be a contradiction. But it wouldn't be if you stop to consider that any writer who has any integrity does all he or she can to know and understand as much about the Real World as possible in order to imbue the stories with as much feeling and substance as possible. If you knew how much actual research goes into a decent science fiction novel you wouldn't see it as ironic at all.
I wrote three novels that had, as subtext, quite a lot to do with economics. A great deal of SF doesn't bother with it, but it always troubled me that all these marvelous things would be depicted in so much science fiction and never any sense of what supported it. Economically, that is. So I cracked the books.
As I noted earlier, I cop to amateur status in many things. For a novel I wrote recently set in the 1780s I had to study quite a lot about the Revolution and the early republic.
Amateur connotes different things to different people. I'm an amateur musician, an amateur historian, an amateur painter. In this country, in the last century, amateur has come to mean someone who either doesn't do something for a living or someone who isn't very good at something. The original meaning, however, which I subscribe to, is from the French—one who loves.
It would be presumptuous to assume one needs to be an expert to be able to understand something well. I suspect, then, that you yourself would be unable to have an opinion on anything you've espoused here, since I believe you are not an "expert" on the bible, either. But we—or at least I—don't play that game.
Thank you for your well-wishing. I wish you success in your pursuits as well.
Samantha seems to be laboring under a delusion – that only 'professionals' need provide citations.
Unfortunately, Samantha, in the reality-based world claims need evidence.
For some claims, the evidence might be implicit (as a matter of common knowledge) such as an object falling to the ground accepts the implicit knowledge that things fall (gravity is evidential but need not be proven since we share the evidence of this every day). For others, the evidence is most definitely required, such as a claim that I can levitate (myself or things). Saying so does not equal proof. Saying I can do so, but only in a dark room with the lights off and no-one watching, is also not proof.
That is the state of the 'evidence' in your Bible (and in every other book of faith). Hearsay, gossip, and purported 'prophecy' that was often written after the events 'prophesied', or prophecies written so vaguely (and translated so many times since) that they can be used to predict anything at all. Stories are not 'evidence'.
Lastly, Samantha, you have been extremely disparaging about Mark's profession of 'Science Fiction Author'. Your comments suggest that his profession robs anything he says of merit. I can only assume this is projection on your part!
Perhaps you have difficulty holding more than one thought at a time, or have difficulty researching and understanding anything contrary to your personal worldview – but that is what an author does. Science Fiction authors (the good ones) take their research very seriously – their audience tends to require accuracy. SF authors may not all be the most tractable folks around(!) but they do tend to be literate, erudite, and scholarly. Research is one thing they all seem to do well.
Erich,
read your article on Dr. Larry Bates- it was interesting.
Many informed Americans are buying both gold and silver has a hedge of protection against our declining dollar and the massive government debt and continual spending spree that promotes our fiat currency system that has literally collapsed many nations.
Also, Dr. Bates is not talking about 'colodial silver' nor is he taling about 'ionic' silver.
He is taling about a new patented silver Technology, FDA and EPA approved product (that he does not sell) called 'Silver Sol Solution' formulated by
Dr. Gordon Pederson, (who "graduated with a Ph.D.from the Toxicology Program at Utah State University. He has a Master's degree in Cardiac Rehabitilation and Wellness and he now serves as the director of the Institute of Alternative Medicine and was nominated to chair the United States Pharmacopocia Review Board Natural Products Committee and host of the radio show "Common Sense Medicine"." You can learn more about Dr. Pederson, and the clinical studies (also documented in his book "A Fighting Chance" listed on his website: http://www.AmericanBioTechLabs.com
When you read about this product, you will be astonished and it is the first FDA full spectrum approval of over 300 known diseases and ailments including clearances against Hospital infections MRSA & VRE and several other extremely resistant strains of bacteria and kills these pathogens in 6-10 minutes of contact. In addition to being an anti-bacteria, it is also anti-fungal and anti-viral and no interaction with any drugs. And yes, it is also approved for eyes and ears and it is topical and ingestible and comes in liquid and a gel.
Dr. Gordon Pederson has also gone before Congress concerning Malaria, as actual clinical studies done in Africa have CURED Malaria within 3-5 days. Also, our military is already using this product, the Center for Disease Control is ordering this product and soon it will be in drug stores nationwide.
Dr. Bates is right on. buy silver as a hedge against inflation and drink SilverSol to built your immune system and fight any infection.
and ps. i do not sell Silver Sol Solution, but after hearing about this product and researching it for myself, i just purchased a ton of it.
thank you,
kate
Time gaps are a problem with all ancient documents. even secular manuscripts, such as Plato, Aristotle ad Homer, but these are rarely questioned as the bible is. There are presently 5,686 Greek manuscripts of the new testament, whose time gaps are less than secular manuscripts. The dead sea scrolls were found in 1947, which included the complete book of Isaiah and fragmented books of almost every book in the old testament. The materials are dated around 100 BC. Rob, on 8/14 gave some good examples of Bible Prophecy. To deny the existence of any of these old testament prophets does not disprove anything. Daniel prophesied the rise and fall of the empires. If he was off the mark about 10 yrs, so what? What is 10 yrs in a span of thousands. I would like to add some, just regarding Jesus. Michah 5:2 says he will come from Bethlehem. Zechariah 9:9 says he will ride on a donkey. Zechariah 11:12&13 says he will be betrayed for thirty pieces of silver. When Jesus said in Matthew 24:34 "This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled", he was talking about a future event. He was saying that the generation that would witness all of the events surrounding Matthew 24 would not pass. Not the disciples.
In my own opinion, I felt as though Mr Tiedemann took the amateur comment very hard. But, he was being compared to David Barton, who has the largest library of historical documents around and we were discussing American History. I do think that my comments were out of line, though. I actually found many of Mr Tiedemann's posts very funny. He is smart and has a good sense of humor. Anyway, I do want him to be successful. I want him to sell so many books that the the stores can't keep them on the shelf. Why? because he sells books and the bookstores have to hire more help, thus creating jobs. Also, Mr Tiedemann is selling so many books that he has to hire people, thus creating jobs. He is making a ton of money so he is going to spend more money, thus patronizing restaurants and stores and maybe going on more vacations. Therefore he is stimulating the economy. The people that are buying the books are getting great entertainment and everyone is happy. I have no problem with rich people. Rich people spend a lot of money.
Samantha,
I didn't take the amateur comment hard—or at least, I didn't take it personally. But arguments from authority should always be distrusted, so…
I wasn't thinking of Matthew, but Mark. 13, 30. "I tell you solemnly, before this generation has passed away all these things will have taken place." This after he told the disciples all the signs that would presage his return. He goes on to tell them, rather specifically, to stay awake and wait for it.
Has it occurred to you to consider that perhaps the writers of the New Testament included all those details from Isaiah in order to make the prophecy fit?
Because Jesus was supposedly from Nazareth, but he was born in Bethlehem. And the supposed census that forced Mary and Joseph to be there that night is nowhere recorded in Roman records—and the Romans kept very good records.
In other words, like purveyors of other religions, isn't it possible they fudged?
I know you don't accept this, but I thought I'd lay it out there.
Anyway, thank you again for your well wishes. I would be very proud to be responsible for employing great numbers of people.
I'd also like to hope some folks actually enjoy what I write. 🙂
Samantha:
Rarely has anyone based their life upon the teachings of Plato, Aristotle, or Homer. Nor have their philosophies created millions of adherents around the world, each firmly (fanatically?) convinced that they hold the one and only truth. Nor does anyone insist that that we should (or did) base our system of government upon Platonic, Homeric, or Aristotelian ideas.
I would recommend to you Bart Ehrman's <span style="font-style: italic;">Misquoting Jesus</span>, which is a fascinating look at early biblical reproduction. May I ask, which version of the bible do you read? Which do you depend upon to provide you with the most accurate translations? Do you read Hebrew, Aramaic or Greek? Do you believe the scrolls found as part of the Dead Sea scrolls which are not included in the bible are "true" in the same way you believe the bible to be? Why or why not? What do you believe about the other apocryphal books, should they have also been included in the bible? How do you resolve the contradictions and inaccuracies between the different versions of the same books?
In terms of prophecy, how do you decide when a prophecy is "close enough" to count as a hit? If Daniel were off by another order of magnitude, would you consider that to be a "miss"? If he were off by a thousand years, would that still count as an accurate prophecy? 10,000 years? Or are you a Christian who believes the earth to be only 6,000 years old? Was Jesus from Bethlehem or from Nazareth? Galilee or Judea? Which prophecies are correct, and how do you decide which are correct?
Do you believe in palm-reading, or tarot cards, or even just the horoscopes in the daily newspaper? Why not? Here's "mine" for today:
Does that seem vague to you? If you don't believe in this sort of prophecy, do you see why others who <span style="font-style: italic;">do</span> believe could twist the meaning or find ways to confirm the prophecy? For example, I don't believe that horoscopes offer any particular prophecy or insight. Although I feel that I can, in fact, clearly see which relationships, food, etc… are good for me, that's not just true on this particular day. I may also decide to take steps to change some of my choices, but that's true on any day. I think I will spend some time alone in thought, and I always expect some changes in business. If I were a believer in prophecy, there's quite a lot there that I could point to and show someone to prove that this prophecy is true. Conversely, since I'm not a believer, there's quite a lot there which seems like it could apply to anyone, on any given day. I think we find ourselves in a similar situation with your biblical prophecies. Believers will always find ways to make the prophecies "true" in some sense, even when it's plain to non-believers that the prophecies are unconscionably vague or unreliable– see "confirmation bias".
Kate – sorry to blow your bubble, but 'Silver Sol' may have a patent (as do many pointless and harmful things) but it does not have FDA or EPA approval as a drug (at least, if it has such approval I can't find it anywhere).
Can you please share the FDA/EPA product pages (FDA publishes their drug safety information at FDA.Gov)
I found one reference to Silver Sol (on fda.gov) that suggested it was making unapproved claims regarding efficacy in treating H1N1 (FDA Warning letter). According to that statement, Silver Sol (Guardian) is listed as a supplement, which means simply that it is a formulation without specific benefit or harm, and that said formulation does not exceed FDA mandated dosage of controlled substances (such as exceeding the dosage of colloidal silver – see FDA statement on dietary supplements containing silver: Letter to Health Care Professionals: FDA Consumer Advisory Regarding Dietary Supplements that Contain Silver October 6, 2009.)
There are no data sheets related to non-drug use (supplements are less regulated than drugs – only their abstract compounding and USE-CLAIMS are controlled)
FDA-Approved does not mean what you think it does.
Hi Brynn, Wow! a lot of questions. There are definitely a lot of smart people on this website. I can't deny that. I have not read the book, but I am assuming that maybe it is giving references about inconsistencies in the Bible based on the many translations. Here's what I know of how we got the Bible. I am no by no means a Bible scholar, nor most likely as educated as most on this website, but here it goes.
1. The Bible is made up of 66 different books written over 1600 yrs. (approx. 1500 BC to AD 100). The old Testament was written mainly in Hebrew, with some Aramaic. the New Testament was written in Greek.
2. 2000 BC old testament events were written down.
3. 500 BC A priest Ezra collects and arranges books of the Hebrew Bible, also The Septuagint in 250-100 BC. (the Septuagint included the Apocrypha until AD 90 whe they were removed b Jewish elders).
4. 4 BC-AD 33 time of Jesus.
5. AD 100 followers of Jesus write the Gospel, history and letters to other Christians and by about AD 150 there was wide circulation.
6. AD 200-300 Latin, Egypt and Syrian translations.
7. 1300 First English Bible translated from Latin in 1382.
8. Bible was first book ever printed on Gutenberg printing press in 1455, Latin Bible. (before printing press Bible was copied by hand, very accurately)
9. more than 5,300 Greek manuscriptss from New Testament still exist.
10. The discovery of the Dead Sea Scroll confirm the reliability of some of the copies of the Old Testament made over the yrs.
11. All but 2,000 groups have the Bible in their own language.
For Prophecy to be fulfilled the prediction must be proven, large time gap, extremely unlikely to happen and unable to be manipulated. There are 100 prophecies alone in the Old Testament, fulfilled by Jesus.
There are many archaeology findings, as well, supporting the Bible and Jesus. In 2002 a limestone box from the 1st century AD with the words "James, son of Joseph, brother of Jesus" inscribed on it was found. In 1920 a small fragment from the Gospel of John was found on papyrus. Also, secular historian Josephus wrote Antiquities AD 93 and Tacitus wrote Annals which both mention Jesus' execution by Pilate.
Finally, there were too many eyewitness saying the same thing. The first being women, when during the time of Jesus, a woman's testimony was considered worthless. If Jesus' followers wanted to fabricate a story they would not have chosen women. Also, the disciples would not knowingly die for a lie. They were not fearless liars who wanted to fool the world. In fact, they fled for their lives after the crucification.
I do not believe in psychics, I pay no attention to that at all. You absolutely cannot compare psychics to the credible prophets of the Bible. And I mostly read the King James Version of the Bible.
Samantha writes:—"I do not believe in psychics, I pay no attention to that at all. You absolutely cannot compare psychics to the credible prophets of the Bible."
There's a contradiction in those two sentences.
You do not "believe in" physics. Do you accept that gravity exists? That's physics.
Be that as it may, if you pay no attention to physics at all, then your next sentence is meaningless. How would you know that a comparison cannot be made if you know next to nothing about one of things you're comparing?
My other quibble remains—there are no "credible prophets". Not just in the bible but anywhere. None. Nada. Zip. Prophecy is a carnival game played on fools. Sorry. It is one with astrology, mind reading, tarot, casting tea leaves and horoscopes, and auras. All so-called prophecy is written in such a way as to cover as many possible outcomes as there could be and most of it goes by the wayside so fast no one remembers it.
But just so you know that I don't consider everything in the Old Testament questionable, it's fairly clear when sufficient archaeological evidence is brought to bear that the Old Testament prophets were talking pretty much about their own times and what might happen in the next decade or century. For many of them, the empire they railed against was Babylon. It all falls apart once you get beyond that.
Again, why hasn't it occurred to you that New Testament authors simply retrofit their stories to take ancient prophecy into account? Not one of the Gospels is an eye-witness account.
Samantha-
Thanks for your response. You're right, I did ask a lot of questions, and I'm afraid that we're missing the forest by looking at the trees in this case.
Let's focus on the areas in which we agree, in the hope that we can find out why we disagree in other areas. For example, you say "I do not believe in psychics, I pay no attention to that at all. You absolutely cannot compare psychics to the credible prophets of the Bible." Let's then agree that psychics are not credible, and those who believe in them are mistaken. But certainly, there are people who believe in psychics and in their ability to foretell the future. There are even some people who give all their money to these psychics, convinced that they gain access to some kind of secret insight or knowledge of the future.
You and I know that such people are deluded, but think of it from their perspective. Put yourself in their shoes, try to see the world the way that they do.
I found this page of "psychic predictions" for the year 2007-2008. Without quibbling whether the predictions actually came true or not, let's presume that we see the predictions the same way as those who really, truly believe in psychic predictions. (Of course, with the benefit of hindsight, we know that few, if any, of these predictions were "validated", which just goes to show you that psychics have a horrible track record.)
I only have one question this time:
What stories do these people (people who believe in psychics) tell themselves in order to convince themselves that the psychic's predictions have been coming true? (After all, presumably they believe at least some of these predictions have been coming true, otherwise why would they continue to listen to the psychic.)
Samantha. I'm very happy to see you continue to comment here. Inquiry is central to reason and understanding. Unfortunately, so is evidence and fact.
Regarding the "James ossuary" (the limestone box:
There are still some scholars who dispute the IAA findings, but none have, to date, provided anything like the definitive proof one should expect if the box were honest. It is only 2000 years old, after all. In addition, the finder of the ossuary, Oded Golan, has been associated with a number of contentious 'antiquities' – he is not a disinterested party. So the ossuary is not a fact.
Regarding the role of women – your statement that during the time of Jesus, a woman’s testimony was considered worthless while generally true was completely false for the early Christians – who were also persecuted for their dionysian approach to life and religion. (note that their persecution by Rome had nothing to do with their lifestyle – but everything to do with their refusal to pay obeisance to Roman Law, and by inference, Roman Gods). They were the long haired hippies of their day, so there is nothing strange about women as witnesses, and indeed the 'story' requires it, since the women were purportedly going to 'annoint' his body – a task that men would not normally have performed. Regardless of this: such an important event, and one central to the 'fulfilled prophesy' of jesus the savior and the bible, should at least be consistent. Especially less than 100 years after the event. This is not so. According to the various books which describe the supposed event, the chronicles differ in many important (and some unimportant) regards. See this link for specific details, but there are significant deviations in timing, number of days, number of people, number of guards, and so on, and substantial deviation from extant Roman practice on Crucifixion (which was leave the criminal 'til they rot).
So – you may believe the resurrection story – but to me it's just another apocryphal tale full of holes.
You also mention Josephus, and also Tacitus' Annals – unfortunately many scholars dispute your interpretation: Chrestianos (the good) versus Christianos (followers of Christ) relating to an erasure of part of an 'e' in the medicean manuscript to then form an 'i', Indeed many dispute the use even of that interpretation, noting the similarity of the greek words for 'slave' and for 'useful' – etymology is rife with such challenges. The challenge does not end there – Pilate was never the 'procurator' of Judea – with such an error a matter of simple Roman record (and Tacitus having been a magistrate would have been intimately aware of the history and roles of prefect vs procurator), what else has been misinterpreted, misconstrued, or simply written incorrectly in the first place!
For these and many other reasons – while you may find the biblical prophets credible I find them to be no more credible than yesterday's horoscope. Seeing credibility in the bible is simply confirmation bias as described earlier.
I'm an idiot. I misread Samantha's "psychics" as "physics." Maybe it's late onset dyslexia.
I apologize.
(Goes off with red face…)
I just want to make sure that I have everything correct. We have the dead sea scrolls and old testament writings which were meticulously copied by a system of counting the words in each book of the Bible to make sure they have copied it accurately. Any scroll found to have error was buried according to Jewish law. This work was done tirelessly to recount fabricated stories of the ancient people? They must of had really good imaginations. Then, we move into the New Testament era where we have over 5,300 manuscripts, other ancient secular writings either describing Christian persecution or Jesus and his disciples (these I find the least credible due to the time gap). Also archaeological findings. The disciples made up the story of Jesus to make the old testament come true, so that they can get themselves killed? For example, Peter crucified upside down, James put to death with the sword, most likely beheading. Matthew killed by the sword, John was boiled in a huge basin but survived to write Revelations. Also, bringing persecution to all who followed Jesus. Whether the writers chose to leave out some details of the tomb scene, I don't know. They all agree that the tomb was empty and that's the point. Jesus was resurrected and appeared to 500 people. If Jesus didn't rise from the grave, the unbeliever is no worse or better off than before. However, If Jesus did rise from the dead, then it's reasonable to believe that everything jesus claimed is true. In my opinion, It takes more faith to believe what you are proposing.
Just a note on those persecutions…
It is true, Rome persecuted Christians, largely between Nero and Diocletian at the end of the Third Century. The bulk of it was spotty and for entirely political reasons. It didn't kick off empire-wide until around 150 or so.
For 150 years, then, there were official oppressions, but put it in perspective. The christians were being persecuted along with Jews—to the Romans they were guilty of the same thing—but something changed by the time of Diocletian (ruled from 284 C.E.) who ramped it up into a real purge.
Constantine not only legalized Christianity but made it the state religion in 313.
Christianity looks, acts, sounds, and ultimately reveals itself as a political movement to displace the majority Roman culture, which they succeeded in doing after two centuries. Once they achieved this, though, they became the oppressors and by the end of the Fourth Century, most pagan religions were illegal and adherents suffering the persecution once reserved for Christians and Jews.
This was a political movement.
And the persecution, btw, has continued of Christian persecuting Christian. It's less violent now, but still.
So, no, the apostles didn't make this stuff up in order to draw the ire of Rome. This was their intellectual world, the documents from which they drew represented cultural continuity for them. They believed this was true. That's no distinction. The ancient Greeks fully believed in Zeus and the pantheon, yet we think they were silly today.
Basically, the early Christians entered into a culture war with the dominant empire to eventually seize the high ground. Many were killed. But with Constantine they won the prize. They turned around and acted like right bigoted little dictators all on their own.
Samantha (and Samantha's husband!): Not to pile on, but one of the biggest red flags causing me to doubt the literal truth of the tales of the Gospels is the lack of any Christian writings regarding the alleged miracles of Jesus for the first 40 years following the alleged death of the alleged Jesus. The only Christian writings created during these 40 years were the epistles. How is it POSSIBLE that the epistles are completely barren of miracle stories of Jesus of Nazareth, the same sorts of tales that fill the Gospels, which were clearly written many decades after the alleged death of Jesus? Earl Dougherty explains.