<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0" xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/" xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/" xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom" xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/" xmlns:media="http://search.yahoo.com/mrss/" > <channel> <title> Comments on: Tortured logic, tortured justice </title> <atom:link href="https://dangerousintersection.org/2009/09/01/tortured-logic/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" /> <link>https://dangerousintersection.org/2009/09/01/tortured-logic/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=tortured-logic&utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=tortured-logic</link> <description>Human Animals at the Crossroads of Science, Religion, Media and Culture</description> <lastBuildDate>Thu, 03 Sep 2009 07:48:08 +0000</lastBuildDate> <sy:updatePeriod> hourly </sy:updatePeriod> <sy:updateFrequency> 1 </sy:updateFrequency> <item> <title> By: Brynn Jacobs </title> <link>https://dangerousintersection.org/2009/09/01/tortured-logic/comment-page-1/#comment-50952</link> <dc:creator><![CDATA[Brynn Jacobs]]></dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 03 Sep 2009 07:48:08 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=8814#comment-50952</guid> <description><![CDATA[I missed this earlier, but Jeremy Scahill has <a href="http://www.alternet.org/story/142336/rebuking_cheney%27s_torture_propaganda_in_7_easy_steps/?page=1" rel="nofollow">a devastating 7-point critique</a> of Dick Cheney's assertions vis-à-vis the torture program. ]]></description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I missed this earlier, but Jeremy Scahill has <a href="http://www.alternet.org/story/142336/rebuking_cheney%27s_torture_propaganda_in_7_easy_steps/?page=1" rel="nofollow">a devastating 7-point critique</a> of Dick Cheney's assertions vis-à-vis the torture program. </p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item> <title> By: Erich Vieth </title> <link>https://dangerousintersection.org/2009/09/01/tortured-logic/comment-page-1/#comment-50909</link> <dc:creator><![CDATA[Erich Vieth]]></dc:creator> <pubDate>Tue, 01 Sep 2009 23:31:53 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=8814#comment-50909</guid> <description><![CDATA[Brynn: I agree entirely. The President AND Congress should immediately order a thorough investigation of the torture conducted by the United States. The vicious sadism that was apparently common in U.S. facilities is being tolerated by many Americans. I assume that many Americans tolerate torture because they buy into the lie that this horrible conduct somehow protects us. If true, this would be yet another example (there are many) that we are driven along much more by cognitive frames than by facts. How else could it be that we aren't getting to the bottom of this? ]]></description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brynn: I agree entirely. The President AND Congress should immediately order a thorough investigation of the torture conducted by the United States. </p> <p>The vicious sadism that was apparently common in U.S. facilities is being tolerated by many Americans. I assume that many Americans tolerate torture because they buy into the lie that this horrible conduct somehow protects us. If true, this would be yet another example (there are many) that we are driven along much more by cognitive frames than by facts. How else could it be that we aren't getting to the bottom of this? </p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item> <title> By: Jeff B </title> <link>https://dangerousintersection.org/2009/09/01/tortured-logic/comment-page-1/#comment-50905</link> <dc:creator><![CDATA[Jeff B]]></dc:creator> <pubDate>Tue, 01 Sep 2009 20:42:16 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=8814#comment-50905</guid> <description><![CDATA[Excellent article Brynn.... the latest episode of Bill Maher on HBO was a great one. Bill Moyers was a guest and spoke about the moral obligations on which President Obama should take a stand. Health care was the main topic, but torture is a HUGE blemish on our recent past. According to Moyers, the President should not worry about re-election and just stand up and fight his detractors. Instead, it seems like President Obama is letting some things slide in fear of damaging his next term. According to Moyers, it's much better to go down fighting for the principles you believe in. This stand would draw support from the many groups who voted for him, hoping for change. If we want to live in a truly free society, we MUST experience some risk in regards to terrorists or other crimes. As you said, we cannot assume guilt until proven innocent, because that is backwards to the great philosophy. If we want to be exposed to less risk, then I guess the nation should move towards more of a police state that prohibits free speech, movement around the nation, and the right of habeas corpus. I, for one, do NOT want to sacrifice my rights or those of any other. Let's hope Eric Holder and his department can embody the national conscience regarding torture, disclosure, and the prosecution of criminal acts. Only by prosecuting the tortures can we prevent this from happening again. ]]></description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent article Brynn…. the latest episode of Bill Maher on HBO was a great one. Bill Moyers was a guest and spoke about the moral obligations on which President Obama should take a stand. Health care was the main topic, but torture is a HUGE blemish on our recent past. According to Moyers, the President should not worry about re-election and just stand up and fight his detractors. Instead, it seems like President Obama is letting some things slide in fear of damaging his next term. According to Moyers, it's much better to go down fighting for the principles you believe in. This stand would draw support from the many groups who voted for him, hoping for change.</p> <p>If we want to live in a truly free society, we MUST experience some risk in regards to terrorists or other crimes. As you said, we cannot assume guilt until proven innocent, because that is backwards to the great philosophy. If we want to be exposed to less risk, then I guess the nation should move towards more of a police state that prohibits free speech, movement around the nation, and the right of habeas corpus. I, for one, do NOT want to sacrifice my rights or those of any other.</p> <p>Let's hope Eric Holder and his department can embody the national conscience regarding torture, disclosure, and the prosecution of criminal acts. Only by prosecuting the tortures can we prevent this from happening again. </p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item> <title> By: NIklaus Pfirsig </title> <link>https://dangerousintersection.org/2009/09/01/tortured-logic/comment-page-1/#comment-50897</link> <dc:creator><![CDATA[NIklaus Pfirsig]]></dc:creator> <pubDate>Tue, 01 Sep 2009 15:14:58 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=8814#comment-50897</guid> <description><![CDATA[Brynn, To get an understanding of the mindset of the German people that allowed them to follow the leadership of the Nationalist-Socialist (NAZI) party, I suggest you read Will Shirer's "Rise and Fall of the Third Reich". The Holocaust was not the first such attempt to exterminate an ethnic group, nor was it the last. It is, however, the one we are continually presented with as the debate killer when anyone critizes the on-goning "ethnic purification" of Palestine by the Israeli military. Ask any Armenian about Armenian history. Or read up on the ethnic cleansing campaigns in Bosnia, Croatia, Darfur, Sierra Leone, or consider the on again off again battles in Northern Ireland. In all cases, the aggressors portrayed themselves as being victimized, and rationalized their actions as defending their nation against subversives within their borders and abroad. For an interesting analysis of the subject check the wikipedia entry on <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genocide" rel="nofollow">genocide</a>. ]]></description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brynn, </p> <p> To get an understanding of the mindset of the German people that allowed them to follow the leadership of the Nationalist-Socialist (NAZI) party, I suggest you read Will Shirer's "Rise and Fall of the Third Reich". </p> <p> The Holocaust was not the first such attempt to exterminate an ethnic group, nor was it the last. It is, however, the one we are continually presented with as the debate killer when anyone critizes the on-goning "ethnic purification" of Palestine by the Israeli military.</p> <p> Ask any Armenian about Armenian history. Or read up on the ethnic cleansing campaigns in Bosnia, Croatia, Darfur, Sierra Leone, or consider the on again off again battles in Northern Ireland. </p> <p> In all cases, the aggressors portrayed themselves as being victimized, and rationalized their actions as defending their nation against subversives within their borders and abroad.</p> <p> For an interesting analysis of the subject check the wikipedia entry on <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genocide" rel="nofollow">genocide</a>. </p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> </channel> </rss>