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	<title>Comments on: Why I am not an atheist &#8230;</title>
	<atom:link href="http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/09/22/why-i-am-not-an-atheist/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/09/22/why-i-am-not-an-atheist/</link>
	<description>Human Animals at the Crossroads of Culture, Science, Religion and Media</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 20 Nov 2009 20:01:19 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Niklaus Pfirsig</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/09/22/why-i-am-not-an-atheist/comment-page-9/#comment-35092</link>
		<dc:creator>Niklaus Pfirsig</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 22:41:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=3162#comment-35092</guid>
		<description>Actually, I think religion needs more humor, like Robin William's "Disco Temple of Comedy" headed by the Right Reverend Earnest Angry ("Those of you watchin' at home  GRAB HOLD of the wires from the back of yore TV sets and FEEL the power!!")

The sad thing is that there would probably be some followers. Kinda like the part in "Life of Brian" where the crowd follows Brian into the desert while he's trying to get away from them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, I think religion needs more humor, like Robin William&#8217;s &#8220;Disco Temple of Comedy&#8221; headed by the Right Reverend Earnest Angry (&#8221;Those of you watchin&#8217; at home  GRAB HOLD of the wires from the back of yore TV sets and FEEL the power!!&#8221;)</p>
<p>The sad thing is that there would probably be some followers. Kinda like the part in &#8220;Life of Brian&#8221; where the crowd follows Brian into the desert while he&#8217;s trying to get away from them.</p>
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		<title>By: Alison</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/09/22/why-i-am-not-an-atheist/comment-page-9/#comment-35065</link>
		<dc:creator>Alison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 14:51:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=3162#comment-35065</guid>
		<description>Don't forget - you need to promise that there are wonderful secrets and rewards waiting for those who show total devotion and abandonment of everything outside the cult (including their cash and worldly possessions, if you play your cards right!)

Oh, and if you want cats, I have some to spare.  In fact, 9 black ones, all bearing a credible resemblance to Basement Cat.  7 of them are fosters, so they could be adopted out without the kids making a fuss.  Heh.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Don&#8217;t forget - you need to promise that there are wonderful secrets and rewards waiting for those who show total devotion and abandonment of everything outside the cult (including their cash and worldly possessions, if you play your cards right!)</p>
<p>Oh, and if you want cats, I have some to spare.  In fact, 9 black ones, all bearing a credible resemblance to Basement Cat.  7 of them are fosters, so they could be adopted out without the kids making a fuss.  Heh.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim Hogan</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/09/22/why-i-am-not-an-atheist/comment-page-9/#comment-35052</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Hogan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 02:06:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=3162#comment-35052</guid>
		<description>I agree with many (actually most) of the points Hank makes about organized religion. 

But I wish some would get that others believe and others don't. I don't give a pile of my cats' holy poops whether you believe or do not believe. Be good for goodness sake! 

Oh, mighty Gravatar, grant me the boon of eternal existence in the internet and the ether with the twin boons of my images and likenesses being forever cast in bits and pieces. Grant that my spoken words forever flail those which disparage cats, and cats' sentient natures. Amen.

Oh, and I'd like to see Hawaii and Australia but, not get stung by any sea wasps.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with many (actually most) of the points Hank makes about organized religion. </p>
<p>But I wish some would get that others believe and others don&#8217;t. I don&#8217;t give a pile of my cats&#8217; holy poops whether you believe or do not believe. Be good for goodness sake! </p>
<p>Oh, mighty Gravatar, grant me the boon of eternal existence in the internet and the ether with the twin boons of my images and likenesses being forever cast in bits and pieces. Grant that my spoken words forever flail those which disparage cats, and cats&#8217; sentient natures. Amen.</p>
<p>Oh, and I&#8217;d like to see Hawaii and Australia but, not get stung by any sea wasps.</p>
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		<title>By: Hank</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/09/22/why-i-am-not-an-atheist/comment-page-9/#comment-35051</link>
		<dc:creator>Hank</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 00:51:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=3162#comment-35051</guid>
		<description>Very true! Healthy self-deception and a malignant persecution complex are essential - if not for you then definitely for your followers. It would serve any potential New Messiah well to ensure that his believers' self-worth and self-esteem are completely bound to their adherence to dogma. This will transform (in their minds at least) any sober, rational criticism of their religion into a white-hot personal attack, an attempt to destroy the religion itself or a pseudo-fascist restriction of their freedom that must be responded to with threats of eternal damnation as well as comparisons with Hitler.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very true! Healthy self-deception and a malignant persecution complex are essential - if not for you then definitely for your followers. It would serve any potential New Messiah well to ensure that his believers&#8217; self-worth and self-esteem are completely bound to their adherence to dogma. This will transform (in their minds at least) any sober, rational criticism of their religion into a white-hot personal attack, an attempt to destroy the religion itself or a pseudo-fascist restriction of their freedom that must be responded to with threats of eternal damnation as well as comparisons with Hitler.</p>
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		<title>By: projektleiterin</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/09/22/why-i-am-not-an-atheist/comment-page-8/#comment-35037</link>
		<dc:creator>projektleiterin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jan 2009 22:49:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=3162#comment-35037</guid>
		<description>I think you must be able to lie to yourself and see yourself as a victim whenever someone calls you out on your shit. If you are too honest with yourself and everybody else it won't work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you must be able to lie to yourself and see yourself as a victim whenever someone calls you out on your shit. If you are too honest with yourself and everybody else it won&#8217;t work.</p>
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		<title>By: Hank</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/09/22/why-i-am-not-an-atheist/comment-page-8/#comment-35031</link>
		<dc:creator>Hank</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jan 2009 22:45:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=3162#comment-35031</guid>
		<description>Vicki:

"Show, don't tell!" Best answer ever!

Great second point as well - maybe Erich's best bet is to indeed go with a proven franchise instead of trying to muscle in on a crowded marketplace. You'd get a guaranteed customer base and very rapid returns if you opened a McJesus instead of taking a risk and starting your own jihad bar.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Vicki:</p>
<p>&#8220;Show, don&#8217;t tell!&#8221; Best answer ever!</p>
<p>Great second point as well - maybe Erich&#8217;s best bet is to indeed go with a proven franchise instead of trying to muscle in on a crowded marketplace. You&#8217;d get a guaranteed customer base and very rapid returns if you opened a McJesus instead of taking a risk and starting your own jihad bar.</p>
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		<title>By: Vicki Baker</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/09/22/why-i-am-not-an-atheist/comment-page-8/#comment-35007</link>
		<dc:creator>Vicki Baker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jan 2009 18:24:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=3162#comment-35007</guid>
		<description>Erich asks:

&lt;blockquote&gt;How do you convince your female followers that making love to you is making love to God himself?
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Show, don't tell!

Also:

&lt;blockquote&gt;
How do you do a successful roll-out without becoming a laughing stock?
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Hmm, this makes me wonder if you really have what it takes to be a religious entrepreneur. I don't think successful messiahs and prophets worry about this. You might be better off opening a franchise of one of the established firms. Perhaps evangelical Protestantism - the training requirements are light and there is a lot of scope for individual variations. Also, most of the logos and other brand collateral is in the public domain, so you don't have to worry about copyright infringement.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Erich asks:</p>
<blockquote><p>How do you convince your female followers that making love to you is making love to God himself?
</p></blockquote>
<p>Show, don&#8217;t tell!</p>
<p>Also:</p>
<blockquote><p>
How do you do a successful roll-out without becoming a laughing stock?
</p></blockquote>
<p>Hmm, this makes me wonder if you really have what it takes to be a religious entrepreneur. I don&#8217;t think successful messiahs and prophets worry about this. You might be better off opening a franchise of one of the established firms. Perhaps evangelical Protestantism - the training requirements are light and there is a lot of scope for individual variations. Also, most of the logos and other brand collateral is in the public domain, so you don&#8217;t have to worry about copyright infringement.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Pulcinella</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/09/22/why-i-am-not-an-atheist/comment-page-8/#comment-35003</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Pulcinella</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jan 2009 15:53:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=3162#comment-35003</guid>
		<description>I think the formula might go like this:

Charisma + new twist + mumbo jumbo + people in need + lots of LUCK = New Religion.

Am I missing anything?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the formula might go like this:</p>
<p>Charisma + new twist + mumbo jumbo + people in need + lots of LUCK = New Religion.</p>
<p>Am I missing anything?</p>
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		<title>By: Hank</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/09/22/why-i-am-not-an-atheist/comment-page-8/#comment-34996</link>
		<dc:creator>Hank</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jan 2009 06:48:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=3162#comment-34996</guid>
		<description>You make some good points! That we completely missed, hyenas that we are.

Rolling out a new product is always the hardest step. It's sort of like being in a band - you can't get noticed until you get noticed, and until you get noticed, noone's going to take any notice.

Might I suggest a snappy logo to start with? Something simple which can be identified straight away and from a long distance. Something geometric like a cross, star, crescent moon. Catchy slogans (verbal logos, really) like "I am the way, the truth and the life" also stick in peoples' minds. You could try "Got soul? Need Erich!" or "I CAN HAS HEAVEN?" (although I think people already worship the LOLcats and you might have some sectarian trouble on your paws). Once your "instant identity" factors are established, the actual articles of faith can be released later - trickled out periodically, like features in open license software. Hook a few diehards in with harmless vague appeals to brotherly love &amp; some cool stories (with, like, magic and shit) before you cement the doctrine - then tell everyone they're doomed if they de-convert!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You make some good points! That we completely missed, hyenas that we are.</p>
<p>Rolling out a new product is always the hardest step. It&#8217;s sort of like being in a band - you can&#8217;t get noticed until you get noticed, and until you get noticed, noone&#8217;s going to take any notice.</p>
<p>Might I suggest a snappy logo to start with? Something simple which can be identified straight away and from a long distance. Something geometric like a cross, star, crescent moon. Catchy slogans (verbal logos, really) like &#8220;I am the way, the truth and the life&#8221; also stick in peoples&#8217; minds. You could try &#8220;Got soul? Need Erich!&#8221; or &#8220;I CAN HAS HEAVEN?&#8221; (although I think people already worship the LOLcats and you might have some sectarian trouble on your paws). Once your &#8220;instant identity&#8221; factors are established, the actual articles of faith can be released later - trickled out periodically, like features in open license software. Hook a few diehards in with harmless vague appeals to brotherly love &amp; some cool stories (with, like, magic and shit) before you cement the doctrine - then tell everyone they&#8217;re doomed if they de-convert!</p>
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		<title>By: Erich Vieth</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/09/22/why-i-am-not-an-atheist/comment-page-8/#comment-34992</link>
		<dc:creator>Erich Vieth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jan 2009 05:57:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=3162#comment-34992</guid>
		<description>OK you laughing hyenas.  Perhaps I didn't express myself clearly enough.  

I could go sew some vestments and burn some incense.  I could write some religious tunes, and I could carefully craft my own religious book (which I will claim was revealed specially to me in an heretofore unknown tongue that I miraculously understood). I'd concoct a menagerie of invisible overseers of my Otherworld.  And as Dan suggests, I could create my own jargon. All of that would be relatively easy. 

I'm wondering about how to do a successful roll-out.  If I got my closest 10 friends together in my living room and announced that I would now share with them a new religion that would bring them peace, life eternal or whatever, I would quickly lose my closest 10 friends, and then they would talk to my other friends and I would lose all of them too.  I would be a laughing stock.  No one would invite me to anything anymore.  My wife would probably leave me.  My kids wouldn't talk to me.  My dog would bite my leg.  

How do you do a successful roll-out without becoming a laughing stock?

Laugh if you must at Joseph Smith and L. Ron Hubbard.  You must admit, though, that they had a certain "genius" for getting masses of people to actually buy into the new scheme (or at least believe that they believed the new scheme, to quote Daniel Dennett). 

That's my question:  How do you bring your new scheme to life?  How do you get recognized on the "Religion" section of the daily paper? How do you convince your followers to support you with their material wealth?  How do you convince your female followers that making love to you is making love to God himself?  Or have I digressed?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK you laughing hyenas.  Perhaps I didn&#8217;t express myself clearly enough.  </p>
<p>I could go sew some vestments and burn some incense.  I could write some religious tunes, and I could carefully craft my own religious book (which I will claim was revealed specially to me in an heretofore unknown tongue that I miraculously understood). I&#8217;d concoct a menagerie of invisible overseers of my Otherworld.  And as Dan suggests, I could create my own jargon. All of that would be relatively easy. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m wondering about how to do a successful roll-out.  If I got my closest 10 friends together in my living room and announced that I would now share with them a new religion that would bring them peace, life eternal or whatever, I would quickly lose my closest 10 friends, and then they would talk to my other friends and I would lose all of them too.  I would be a laughing stock.  No one would invite me to anything anymore.  My wife would probably leave me.  My kids wouldn&#8217;t talk to me.  My dog would bite my leg.  </p>
<p>How do you do a successful roll-out without becoming a laughing stock?</p>
<p>Laugh if you must at Joseph Smith and L. Ron Hubbard.  You must admit, though, that they had a certain &#8220;genius&#8221; for getting masses of people to actually buy into the new scheme (or at least believe that they believed the new scheme, to quote Daniel Dennett). </p>
<p>That&#8217;s my question:  How do you bring your new scheme to life?  How do you get recognized on the &#8220;Religion&#8221; section of the daily paper? How do you convince your followers to support you with their material wealth?  How do you convince your female followers that making love to you is making love to God himself?  Or have I digressed?</p>
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