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	<title>Comments on: The Kirkwood shooter and a challenge to investigative journalists</title>
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	<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/02/09/the-kirkwood-shooter-and-a-challenge-to-investigative-journalists/</link>
	<description>Human Animals at the Crossroads of Culture, Science, Religion and Media</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 03:38:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Nancy Seats</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/02/09/the-kirkwood-shooter-and-a-challenge-to-investigative-journalists/#comment-16582</link>
		<dc:creator>Nancy Seats</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Mar 2008 20:12:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=2154#comment-16582</guid>
		<description>Because the remaining elected officials of the City of Kirkwood continue to insist that the election will be held on April 8 as schduled they are causing even more divisiveness. There is only one candidate left on the ballot for Mayor due to the death of Connie Karr. The people deserve an opportunity to have a choice for Mayor. The one candidate on the ballot will serve a four year term, and thousands of citizens of Kirkwood don't feel that he represents them.

This candidate had never visited Meacham Park until the Sunday (to attend church) after the last City Council meeting held on a cold, rainy night, and attended by at least 250 citizens many of whom spoke with passion about delaying the election. A former Mayor called us all the "vocal minority". Hmm! Where have we heard those words used before?

Unless and until, the city officials begin listening to and representing ALL citizens of Kirkwood there will be disenfranchisement and I pray that it doesn't lead to more violence.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Because the remaining elected officials of the City of Kirkwood continue to insist that the election will be held on April 8 as schduled they are causing even more divisiveness. There is only one candidate left on the ballot for Mayor due to the death of Connie Karr. The people deserve an opportunity to have a choice for Mayor. The one candidate on the ballot will serve a four year term, and thousands of citizens of Kirkwood don&#8217;t feel that he represents them.</p>
<p>This candidate had never visited Meacham Park until the Sunday (to attend church) after the last City Council meeting held on a cold, rainy night, and attended by at least 250 citizens many of whom spoke with passion about delaying the election. A former Mayor called us all the &#8220;vocal minority&#8221;. Hmm! Where have we heard those words used before?</p>
<p>Unless and until, the city officials begin listening to and representing ALL citizens of Kirkwood there will be disenfranchisement and I pray that it doesn&#8217;t lead to more violence.</p>
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		<title>By: Phillip</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/02/09/the-kirkwood-shooter-and-a-challenge-to-investigative-journalists/#comment-16129</link>
		<dc:creator>Phillip</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Feb 2008 21:43:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=2154#comment-16129</guid>
		<description>This is the story I have been looking for! Sadly, such thought provoking and "beneath the surface," writing isn't present, or even likely to be found on the pages of the Post Dispatch, or even locally in the Webster-Kirkwood Times! 

As a resident of Kirkwood, and someone who has been touched by the good that Cookie offered the community, I find it refreshing to see real journalism, without the sensational rhetoric that selectively offers statements, only to present them as universal opinions.

Though I could not bring myself to enter the sanctuary this afternoon, where Cookie was recieving his last goodbyes, I couldn't help but notice the real acceptance of this man by the larger community. One couldn't drive down Clay, or Harrison without being caught by the gastly amount of residents, black and white, entering the sanctuary to visit Cookie.

I'm still too emotional to clarify much more about the topic, although I will make sure to send this to every news outlet in the region, with a note about how someone captured the real story of this tragedy, and the article didn't even need flashy blue graphics.

Thank you, thank you, thank you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is the story I have been looking for! Sadly, such thought provoking and &#8220;beneath the surface,&#8221; writing isn&#8217;t present, or even likely to be found on the pages of the Post Dispatch, or even locally in the Webster-Kirkwood Times! </p>
<p>As a resident of Kirkwood, and someone who has been touched by the good that Cookie offered the community, I find it refreshing to see real journalism, without the sensational rhetoric that selectively offers statements, only to present them as universal opinions.</p>
<p>Though I could not bring myself to enter the sanctuary this afternoon, where Cookie was recieving his last goodbyes, I couldn&#8217;t help but notice the real acceptance of this man by the larger community. One couldn&#8217;t drive down Clay, or Harrison without being caught by the gastly amount of residents, black and white, entering the sanctuary to visit Cookie.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m still too emotional to clarify much more about the topic, although I will make sure to send this to every news outlet in the region, with a note about how someone captured the real story of this tragedy, and the article didn&#8217;t even need flashy blue graphics.</p>
<p>Thank you, thank you, thank you.</p>
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		<title>By: Penny</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/02/09/the-kirkwood-shooter-and-a-challenge-to-investigative-journalists/#comment-16121</link>
		<dc:creator>Penny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Feb 2008 03:33:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=2154#comment-16121</guid>
		<description>Mindy:  Thank you for your extremely thought-provoking work.  As a former resident of Kirkwood, the shootings last week have left me devastated and searching for answers.  My heart has always been in Kirkwood and during these troubled days even more so.  

I think, if there is to be any "good" resulting from this situation, it lies in the heart of your post.  This is a complicated issue that merits an investigation into not only what factors contributed to Cookie's actions (perhaps a symbol of a bigger issue as you suggest), and what we can do as a human community to keep this kind of tragedy from happening again.  Thank you again...your post has given me great comfort and fed my heart and my head.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mindy:  Thank you for your extremely thought-provoking work.  As a former resident of Kirkwood, the shootings last week have left me devastated and searching for answers.  My heart has always been in Kirkwood and during these troubled days even more so.  </p>
<p>I think, if there is to be any &#8220;good&#8221; resulting from this situation, it lies in the heart of your post.  This is a complicated issue that merits an investigation into not only what factors contributed to Cookie&#8217;s actions (perhaps a symbol of a bigger issue as you suggest), and what we can do as a human community to keep this kind of tragedy from happening again.  Thank you again&#8230;your post has given me great comfort and fed my heart and my head.</p>
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		<title>By: Erich Vieth</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/02/09/the-kirkwood-shooter-and-a-challenge-to-investigative-journalists/#comment-16077</link>
		<dc:creator>Erich Vieth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 20:04:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=2154#comment-16077</guid>
		<description>Mindy:  Your post powerfully reminded me that there is often a valuable story that remains untold.   Your call for responsible investigative journalism is right on.   I thought about what would happen if we expanded your suggestions to covering Iraq.   

Instead of "insurgents" and "terrorists" (and their families) getting bombed in masse, is it possible that the many of thousands of human beings who resist the efforts of the U.S. to permanently occupy Iraq (and to force the cheap sale of Iraqi oil to the U.S.) have legitimate gripes?  Is it possible that U.S. troops and the U.S. sponsored Iraqi security forces have brutalized many of the people who are against the continued U.S. occupation?  Is it possible that, were the full story to come out, that U.S. citizens wouldn't be willing to continue funding this gristly occupation?

The unwillingness of the U.S. news media to take the time and effort to carefully investigate and tell the thousands of stories of the "insurgents" means that citizens of the U.S. will continue to see Iraq simplistically, in terms of black and white.  What is happening in Iraq will remain a "war" between the "greatest country in the world," where we are battling the "bad guys."  

I see that the St. Louis news media is now at least asking the important questions you raised regarding the case of Cookie Thornton.   I see little hope that the national news media will tell similarly detailed stories about the people resisting the U.S. occupation of Iraq.  

I'm not suggesting that the motives and the actions of the "insurgents" are necessarily admirable.   It's probably a mixed bag.   But don't U.S. news consumers deserve enough trust from the Bush Administration and the corporate dominated news media to hear all sides of the issue?

By the way, if you want to see how incredibly disingenuous the Bush administration is, check out Bush's recent characterization of the foreign policy proposed by Barack Obama: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/02/10/bush-obama-would-attack_n_85885.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mindy:  Your post powerfully reminded me that there is often a valuable story that remains untold.   Your call for responsible investigative journalism is right on.   I thought about what would happen if we expanded your suggestions to covering Iraq.   </p>
<p>Instead of &#8220;insurgents&#8221; and &#8220;terrorists&#8221; (and their families) getting bombed in masse, is it possible that the many of thousands of human beings who resist the efforts of the U.S. to permanently occupy Iraq (and to force the cheap sale of Iraqi oil to the U.S.) have legitimate gripes?  Is it possible that U.S. troops and the U.S. sponsored Iraqi security forces have brutalized many of the people who are against the continued U.S. occupation?  Is it possible that, were the full story to come out, that U.S. citizens wouldn&#8217;t be willing to continue funding this gristly occupation?</p>
<p>The unwillingness of the U.S. news media to take the time and effort to carefully investigate and tell the thousands of stories of the &#8220;insurgents&#8221; means that citizens of the U.S. will continue to see Iraq simplistically, in terms of black and white.  What is happening in Iraq will remain a &#8220;war&#8221; between the &#8220;greatest country in the world,&#8221; where we are battling the &#8220;bad guys.&#8221;  </p>
<p>I see that the St. Louis news media is now at least asking the important questions you raised regarding the case of Cookie Thornton.   I see little hope that the national news media will tell similarly detailed stories about the people resisting the U.S. occupation of Iraq.  </p>
<p>I&#8217;m not suggesting that the motives and the actions of the &#8220;insurgents&#8221; are necessarily admirable.   It&#8217;s probably a mixed bag.   But don&#8217;t U.S. news consumers deserve enough trust from the Bush Administration and the corporate dominated news media to hear all sides of the issue?</p>
<p>By the way, if you want to see how incredibly disingenuous the Bush administration is, check out Bush&#8217;s recent characterization of the foreign policy proposed by Barack Obama: <a href="http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/02/10/bush-obama-would-attack_n_85885.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/02/10/bush-obama-would-attack_n_85885.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Erich Vieth</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/02/09/the-kirkwood-shooter-and-a-challenge-to-investigative-journalists/#comment-16075</link>
		<dc:creator>Erich Vieth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 16:52:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=2154#comment-16075</guid>
		<description>Mindy: Thank you for this post. It goes so much deeper than anything I'd seen or heard by the local press, at least until the Post Dispatch published &lt;a href="http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/columnists.nsf/sylvesterbrownjr/story/6A154595A7C60957862573EA00202CBA?OpenDocument " target="_blank"&gt;this column by Sylvester Brown this morning.&lt;/a&gt;

The murders were reprehensible. But you are right, that the situation is much more complex than simply focusing on the pulling of a trigger. This shocking multiple murder could be a learning experience, if we back up far enough to look at this situation from a perspective other than the official "government is always right" perspective.

The relatives of Thornton are making pointed accusations. If Cookie Thornton was playing by the rules and yet he was lied to and harassed by the Kirkwood government, it could explain why he was driven to such desperation.

A comprehensive investigation needs to be even handed, of course. What if Cookie Thornton was treated no differently than any other similarly situated contractors? What if his bid was higher than the winners or his work not a good? If true, we should treat him just like we would treat any other person who failed to place the winning bid on a project, and reacted by committing murder.

Then again, this comprehensive approach seems to suggest that whether a murder is justified hinges on whether the shooter was the victim of corruption or government harassment. That's apparently the pragmatic way many of the citizens of Meacham Park see it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mindy: Thank you for this post. It goes so much deeper than anything I&#8217;d seen or heard by the local press, at least until the Post Dispatch published <a href="http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/columnists.nsf/sylvesterbrownjr/story/6A154595A7C60957862573EA00202CBA?OpenDocument " target="_blank">this column by Sylvester Brown this morning.</a></p>
<p>The murders were reprehensible. But you are right, that the situation is much more complex than simply focusing on the pulling of a trigger. This shocking multiple murder could be a learning experience, if we back up far enough to look at this situation from a perspective other than the official &#8220;government is always right&#8221; perspective.</p>
<p>The relatives of Thornton are making pointed accusations. If Cookie Thornton was playing by the rules and yet he was lied to and harassed by the Kirkwood government, it could explain why he was driven to such desperation.</p>
<p>A comprehensive investigation needs to be even handed, of course. What if Cookie Thornton was treated no differently than any other similarly situated contractors? What if his bid was higher than the winners or his work not a good? If true, we should treat him just like we would treat any other person who failed to place the winning bid on a project, and reacted by committing murder.</p>
<p>Then again, this comprehensive approach seems to suggest that whether a murder is justified hinges on whether the shooter was the victim of corruption or government harassment. That&#8217;s apparently the pragmatic way many of the citizens of Meacham Park see it.</p>
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