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	<title>Comments on: Unicef Photo of the Year - Child Brides</title>
	<atom:link href="http://dangerousintersection.org/2007/12/19/unicef-photo-of-the-year-child-brides/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2007/12/19/unicef-photo-of-the-year-child-brides/</link>
	<description>Human Animals at the Crossroads of Culture, Science, Religion and Media</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jan 2009 00:59:31 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: projektleiterin</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2007/12/19/unicef-photo-of-the-year-child-brides/#comment-15976</link>
		<dc:creator>projektleiterin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Feb 2008 17:56:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=1951#comment-15976</guid>
		<description>Seems like Germany is not the only country where people turn a blind eye to honor killings in order not to appear racist.
&lt;blockquote&gt;According to official figures, 10 to 12 women are murdered in Britain in honour killings each year, but the government has been warned by MPs that this is a serious underestimate. Police often record the deaths as cases of domestic violence, while other girls are driven to suicide or taken away to their family's country of origin and never seen again. &lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;The study criticises the police and schools for failing to take action in a misguided attempt to avoid offending cultural sensibilities.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;"Police have a long way to go before they get on top of honour crime. There is a lingering fear among officers of being dubbed racist for probing cultural issues. We've got to shake off that myth," she said.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article3295487.ece</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Seems like Germany is not the only country where people turn a blind eye to honor killings in order not to appear racist.</p>
<blockquote><p>According to official figures, 10 to 12 women are murdered in Britain in honour killings each year, but the government has been warned by MPs that this is a serious underestimate. Police often record the deaths as cases of domestic violence, while other girls are driven to suicide or taken away to their family&#8217;s country of origin and never seen again. </p></blockquote>
<blockquote><p>The study criticises the police and schools for failing to take action in a misguided attempt to avoid offending cultural sensibilities.</p></blockquote>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;Police have a long way to go before they get on top of honour crime. There is a lingering fear among officers of being dubbed racist for probing cultural issues. We&#8217;ve got to shake off that myth,&#8221; she said.</p></blockquote>
<p><a href="http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article3295487.ece" rel="nofollow">http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article3295487.ece</a></p>
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		<title>By: Erich Vieth</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2007/12/19/unicef-photo-of-the-year-child-brides/#comment-15827</link>
		<dc:creator>Erich Vieth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jan 2008 14:40:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=1951#comment-15827</guid>
		<description>The Taliban policy of keeping girls out of school was based on a very strong cultural prohibition against having women mix with unrelated men. Those traditions still define large swaths of Afghan society--even in urban areas like Kabul. "My family says that they would rather I be illiterate than be taught by a man," says Yasamin Rezzaie, 18, who is learning dressmaking at a women's center in Kabul. Her parents refused to let her go to her neighborhood school because some of the teachers are male. Both her parents are illiterate, and they don't see the need for her to learn to read when the risk of meeting unrelated men is so high.

. . . 

"In Afghan culture, women are seen as the repository of family honor, and the education of girls--whether in terms of the design of school buildings or in the way in which classes are conducted--needs to reflect that reality," says Matt Waldman, the Afghan policy adviser for Oxfam, which released a damning report in 2006 on the state of education in Afghanistan. It shows that the ratio of boys to girls in primary school is roughly 2 to 1, but by the time girls enter secondary school (and puberty), the ratio drops to four boys for every girl. In more than 80% of rural districts, there are no girls in secondary school at all. Overall, only 10% of girls in school actually obtain a diploma.

From Time Magazine - full article at http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1704654,00.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Taliban policy of keeping girls out of school was based on a very strong cultural prohibition against having women mix with unrelated men. Those traditions still define large swaths of Afghan society&#8211;even in urban areas like Kabul. &#8220;My family says that they would rather I be illiterate than be taught by a man,&#8221; says Yasamin Rezzaie, 18, who is learning dressmaking at a women&#8217;s center in Kabul. Her parents refused to let her go to her neighborhood school because some of the teachers are male. Both her parents are illiterate, and they don&#8217;t see the need for her to learn to read when the risk of meeting unrelated men is so high.</p>
<p>. . . </p>
<p>&#8220;In Afghan culture, women are seen as the repository of family honor, and the education of girls&#8211;whether in terms of the design of school buildings or in the way in which classes are conducted&#8211;needs to reflect that reality,&#8221; says Matt Waldman, the Afghan policy adviser for Oxfam, which released a damning report in 2006 on the state of education in Afghanistan. It shows that the ratio of boys to girls in primary school is roughly 2 to 1, but by the time girls enter secondary school (and puberty), the ratio drops to four boys for every girl. In more than 80% of rural districts, there are no girls in secondary school at all. Overall, only 10% of girls in school actually obtain a diploma.</p>
<p>From Time Magazine - full article at <a href="http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1704654,00.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1704654,00.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: grumpypilgrim</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2007/12/19/unicef-photo-of-the-year-child-brides/#comment-15462</link>
		<dc:creator>grumpypilgrim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Dec 2007 01:46:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=1951#comment-15462</guid>
		<description>What I find interesting about the above post is that, in the rest of the animal world, mating begins promptly after sexual maturity occurs; but humans are not considered suitable for parenthood until several years after we reach sexual maturity.  I've often wondered how the 'intelligent design' folks would explain this -- why God 'designed' us to reach sexually maturity so many years prematurely.  Carrying this tangent one step farther, I've also wondered how they would explain why God made our eyes go bad sometime between our 40th &#38; 50th birthdays, even though we routinely live well beyond age 50.  Seems an odd thing to design a human to live, according to the Bible, 900+ years, yet give us eyes that only last about 45.  For instance, I wonder how Noah, who was reportedly more than 500 years old at the time of the Flood, managed to see well enough to build the Ark, given that his eyesight would have failed several centuries earlier.

As regards child brides, I don't mean to condone the practice, but I do caution that western cultural mores don't necessarily translate to the Third World.  It is possible that women in the above-mentioned culture have less use for a schoolroom education than they have for an older husband.  I'm not saying this is good, merely that it might be the current reality.  Something to consider, at least, before we attack the practice, as difficult as it might be for us to stomach.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What I find interesting about the above post is that, in the rest of the animal world, mating begins promptly after sexual maturity occurs; but humans are not considered suitable for parenthood until several years after we reach sexual maturity.  I&#8217;ve often wondered how the &#8216;intelligent design&#8217; folks would explain this &#8212; why God &#8216;designed&#8217; us to reach sexually maturity so many years prematurely.  Carrying this tangent one step farther, I&#8217;ve also wondered how they would explain why God made our eyes go bad sometime between our 40th &amp; 50th birthdays, even though we routinely live well beyond age 50.  Seems an odd thing to design a human to live, according to the Bible, 900+ years, yet give us eyes that only last about 45.  For instance, I wonder how Noah, who was reportedly more than 500 years old at the time of the Flood, managed to see well enough to build the Ark, given that his eyesight would have failed several centuries earlier.</p>
<p>As regards child brides, I don&#8217;t mean to condone the practice, but I do caution that western cultural mores don&#8217;t necessarily translate to the Third World.  It is possible that women in the above-mentioned culture have less use for a schoolroom education than they have for an older husband.  I&#8217;m not saying this is good, merely that it might be the current reality.  Something to consider, at least, before we attack the practice, as difficult as it might be for us to stomach.</p>
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		<title>By: Vicki Baker</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2007/12/19/unicef-photo-of-the-year-child-brides/#comment-15458</link>
		<dc:creator>Vicki Baker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Dec 2007 20:43:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=1951#comment-15458</guid>
		<description>I guess I feel that it's OK for me to criticize, as long as it doesn't make me feel better. Sorry to impose that on you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I guess I feel that it&#8217;s OK for me to criticize, as long as it doesn&#8217;t make me feel better. Sorry to impose that on you.</p>
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		<title>By: projektleiterin</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2007/12/19/unicef-photo-of-the-year-child-brides/#comment-15436</link>
		<dc:creator>projektleiterin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Dec 2007 09:21:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=1951#comment-15436</guid>
		<description>Let me just disapprove once in a while without having a clever solution at hand that would resolve everything with the push of a button. And in order to be able to develop a solution for a problem you must be allowed to say that something is a problem.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let me just disapprove once in a while without having a clever solution at hand that would resolve everything with the push of a button. And in order to be able to develop a solution for a problem you must be allowed to say that something is a problem.</p>
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		<title>By: Vicki Baker</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2007/12/19/unicef-photo-of-the-year-child-brides/#comment-15427</link>
		<dc:creator>Vicki Baker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Dec 2007 23:50:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=1951#comment-15427</guid>
		<description>PL, you're allowed to do whatever you want, However, if you want to help girls like Ghulam and do something about both traditional and modern forms of human trafficking and slavery,  there are going to be some things that are effective and other things that are not.  I refuse to take comfort in merely disapproving of a "backward" culture and wishing they would just be more like "us."</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>PL, you&#8217;re allowed to do whatever you want, However, if you want to help girls like Ghulam and do something about both traditional and modern forms of human trafficking and slavery,  there are going to be some things that are effective and other things that are not.  I refuse to take comfort in merely disapproving of a &#8220;backward&#8221; culture and wishing they would just be more like &#8220;us.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: projektleiterin</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2007/12/19/unicef-photo-of-the-year-child-brides/#comment-15402</link>
		<dc:creator>projektleiterin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Dec 2007 23:53:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=1951#comment-15402</guid>
		<description>But Vicky, you are not even allowed to disapprove, that's my point. And well, your post did prove it. The first reaction always seems to be "So, you think the solution is to kill them?"

Nikolaus, I just cited the NY Times, because it's in English. I did not choose it because it focused on Islamic countries. As I said in my first post, I may not know how Turkish courts implement the law against marital rape, but at least it exists, so if a man runs around and burns his wife, I really doubt he would get away there with the excuse that he is from a different culture with different values and has problems with integration. And yes, I know, Turkey is a secular state, but some people just count it as another Islamic culture where men just do what they want to do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But Vicky, you are not even allowed to disapprove, that&#8217;s my point. And well, your post did prove it. The first reaction always seems to be &#8220;So, you think the solution is to kill them?&#8221;</p>
<p>Nikolaus, I just cited the NY Times, because it&#8217;s in English. I did not choose it because it focused on Islamic countries. As I said in my first post, I may not know how Turkish courts implement the law against marital rape, but at least it exists, so if a man runs around and burns his wife, I really doubt he would get away there with the excuse that he is from a different culture with different values and has problems with integration. And yes, I know, Turkey is a secular state, but some people just count it as another Islamic culture where men just do what they want to do.</p>
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		<title>By: Niklaus Pfirsig</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2007/12/19/unicef-photo-of-the-year-child-brides/#comment-15395</link>
		<dc:creator>Niklaus Pfirsig</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Dec 2007 23:46:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=1951#comment-15395</guid>
		<description>Part of my point is that UNICEF, as an internation organization, has no allegience to the corporate run American government. The NY Times article, from which the cut-lines are taken, mentions only the countries with followers of Islam in the population that have some economic importance to the US government and multinational corporations. The UNICEF study shows that the practice is much more widespread than just western Asia and north Africa, and is not limited to that part of the world. It is also common in areas of South America, in countries that are predominently Christian.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Part of my point is that UNICEF, as an internation organization, has no allegience to the corporate run American government. The NY Times article, from which the cut-lines are taken, mentions only the countries with followers of Islam in the population that have some economic importance to the US government and multinational corporations. The UNICEF study shows that the practice is much more widespread than just western Asia and north Africa, and is not limited to that part of the world. It is also common in areas of South America, in countries that are predominently Christian.</p>
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		<title>By: projektleiterin</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2007/12/19/unicef-photo-of-the-year-child-brides/#comment-15394</link>
		<dc:creator>projektleiterin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Dec 2007 23:28:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=1951#comment-15394</guid>
		<description>Here's an article about the situation of Turkish women in German courts: &lt;a href="http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/0,1518,473017,00.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/0,1518,473017,00.html&lt;/a&gt;

Here is an article about the man who burned his wife (it's in German though):
&lt;a href="http://www.spiegel.de/panorama/justiz/0,1518,509523,00.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;http://www.spiegel.de/panorama/justiz/0,1518,509523,00.html&lt;/a&gt;
He says a lot of disgusting stuff about his wife, like, "I watched with satisfaction as her face burnt." The article doesn't say anything about the verdict, but I remember that he was also excused by the judge for being a member of a different culture.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s an article about the situation of Turkish women in German courts: <a href="http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/0,1518,473017,00.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/0,1518,473017,00.html</a></p>
<p>Here is an article about the man who burned his wife (it&#8217;s in German though):<br />
<a href="http://www.spiegel.de/panorama/justiz/0,1518,509523,00.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.spiegel.de/panorama/justiz/0,1518,509523,00.html</a><br />
He says a lot of disgusting stuff about his wife, like, &#8220;I watched with satisfaction as her face burnt.&#8221; The article doesn&#8217;t say anything about the verdict, but I remember that he was also excused by the judge for being a member of a different culture.</p>
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		<title>By: Vicki Baker</title>
		<link>http://dangerousintersection.org/2007/12/19/unicef-photo-of-the-year-child-brides/#comment-15392</link>
		<dc:creator>Vicki Baker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Dec 2007 23:16:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dangerousintersection.org/?p=1951#comment-15392</guid>
		<description>Peace! I'm not saying you're advocating invading bombing and invading, but we have to do something other than just disapprove. We have to do something other than just offer charity bandaids. And that might mean taking a hard serious look at our own priorities. If Afghanistan follows the model of globalization in other underdeveloped countries, Ghulam will have the choice between working in a sweatshop or become part of the global human trafficking network. What an improvement!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Peace! I&#8217;m not saying you&#8217;re advocating invading bombing and invading, but we have to do something other than just disapprove. We have to do something other than just offer charity bandaids. And that might mean taking a hard serious look at our own priorities. If Afghanistan follows the model of globalization in other underdeveloped countries, Ghulam will have the choice between working in a sweatshop or become part of the global human trafficking network. What an improvement!</p>
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