For the true believer, prayer also has a placebo effect, making it, arguably, more than just wishful thinking. Of course, it’s still not what the believer believes or hopes it to be — viz., an invocation of divine power — but it can, in a sense, have a “real” impact on the person’s life. Of course, praying to Thor, Zeus or the Flying Spaghetti Monster will be no more or less effective, it just depends on what the person believes.

I know people who belong to churches and go through all the motions, but don’t swallow all the dogma. I know people who have some pretty nontheistic beliefs that they try to reconcile with all kinds of reality. I know more people who will pray or meditate or “send out energy” than those who won’t, and it all stems from hopefulness that they, although helpless to change anything, will be able to somehow make a difference. Is it silly? Well, kind of, but it’s far from odd. Is it effective? No, but it’s better than shrugging something off and saying “Well, good luck with that. Seeya later.” And for the most part, it’s harmless.

Where it is harmful is when it is used by unscrupulous people to benefit themselves - as in the wealthy preachers promising things they can’t deliver in exchange for the money of those who can’t afford to spend it. (Or the ridiculous costs of classes in how to “master” various spiritual techniques for healing that are ineffective, as well.) When it is also harmful is when it is used in place of action by people who actually have the power to effect change. It is harmful for Bush to pray for peace, while doing nothing to end his war. It is harmful for the Pope to pray for an end to pedophilia while allowing pedophiles to hide in his church. It is harmful to pray for an end to abortion after inciting violent anger towards people who perform it.

As long as we believe that prayer is effective, we’re giving the people who use the harmful kind a get-out-of-jail-free card. As long as they’re praying, they’re at least doing something. As long as they’re praying, their intentions are good. As long as they’re praying, there’s a possibility that it might happen. This is when prayer is dangerous, but as long as we all believe that it’s effective, this won’t change. In order to force those who pray for an outcome while acting to obstruct that outcome, we have to accept prayer for what it really is - wishful thinking - and make people accountable for their own actions.

I often wonder how Christian Fundies avoid problems with this, given the boastful way so many of them parade their claimed beliefs. Not that they necessarily gain advantage or enrichment in the sense Vesperiant probably means (i.e., material gain), but they certainly do seem overly certain of their eternal salvation.

Vesperiant’s observation also rings true in this season of presidential politics, with some candidates nearly tripping over themselves to win the evangelical vote. It’s sad that so many evangelicals are so easily convinced of a candidates superior merits merely because said individual declares a belief in Jesus. Of course, some have the history to back it up, but most don’t. For these folks, declarations of religious belief are probably one of the easiest ways to deceive voters. We need only think of the Ted Haggards and Jim Bakers of this world to know that claims of religious belief need have little in common with a “believer’s” private affairs.

Yes, this situation is very, very sad. They claim to believe in God and yet they do nothing to protect the least of his children. They are simply a beaurocracy trying to protect themselves from their own criminal behavior. It simply goes to show that God often has as much to do with organized religion as He does with the auto club.

Many biblical scholars interpret the second commandment, “Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain” not to prohibit us from saying “Goddammit”, or some other alleged profanity, rather they see it as a firm injunction against those who would misrepresent God to their own advantage or enrichment. I think that this behavior falls into that category. Tragic.

A Vatican cardinal is calling for special prayer sessions worldwide for the victims of sexual abuse by priests.

A letter has been sent to bishops urging them to promote initiatives in their dioceses for special prayers, Cardinal Claudio Hummes said in an interview published in Saturday’s edition of Vatican daily L’Osservatore Romano. He did not indicate when such initiatives might begin.

There you have it.  The solution is praying to an invisible sentient Being, rather than proper oversight regarding highly educated adults who are raping children.   See here for more.

I’m not sure how people can put their faith into someone they’ve never met!

You believe in faeries?! And magic. What’s the difference here to religion?

(Sometimes I pray to my Shih Tzu, “Skittles” (Dog) I’ve noticed that ever since we brought her into our lives we have had unbelievable good luck! I think that it’s her. no I’m not into witch craft or magic or anything so don’t say it. I get that a lot because I love nature and faeries and Magic goofy stuff. I love reading about spells and stuff of that nature but am affraid to actually go through with it. :))

Love one another??? Who do you think you are….Jesus?

Vesperiant, I am quite hesitant to disagree with you ever since seeing your physique on that bodybuilding tape. God bless