You are welcome. No, I have never had a problem with homosexuality. I did struggle with sexual sin before becoming a Christian. I still battle it today but the difference is I have victory (overcome the temptation).

Sorry Mark but it plainly reads that if no one hears her scream then she is innocent and not to be punished (you are adding what is not there).

Again you are generalizing about the times. Yes, in society as a whole, there was not equality but that does not mean that God made it that way. If you read Genesis then you will see that God created them in His image (equals before Him). When sin came into the picture man began to seek inequality. Again you try to blame God for man’s sin. Plus, the entire world treated women as property then (not that it was right but it is a fact).

[Admin's note: Part of this comment constitute "preaching." That portion is an attempt to announce what "God" thinks or what "God" wants, as though there is no alternative viewpoint as to what God "thinks" or "wants." In my opinion, such presentations are distracting to our discussions, which (though such comments might well be motivated by a commenter's religious beliefs) should be based on what commenter's themselves think. Such comments seem to invite an endless and unproductive back and forth focused on the authenticity of such claims. Further discussion of what is starkly presented as "God's" opinion, or any quotation to any passages from any religion's Sacred Literature, to the extent that those passages are intended to be unquestionable on any ground, are subject to pruning pursuant to the commenting guidelines regarding "preaching"].

Concubines were condemned by God. Plus it happened among the elite of society. Your average Joe did not have concubines so please do not overstate the point. Plus look at all the problems that those who had concubines experienced because of the concubines (Abraham, David, Solomon).

Sexual sin was a major issue in the world during the OT days (that is why God had to give the commands about sexual purity). Israel was a unique nation because God set them apart and gave them the Law for their protection. Generally speaking their morality was higher (until they were influenced by their immoral neighbors, so you see, promoting immorality is dangerous).

Also God lays out the boundaries for sex in the very beginning (one man and one woman in marriage).

I have more to write so do not jump the gun.

The uneducated swear (spend some time with people in the real word). It is a bit of a generalization (I realize that). But for the most part, the more vulgar the language the lower the education level (get out and meet different people and you might see that).

Also, when a person cannot argue his point then he turns to personal attacks being very aggressive, ranting and raving (thanks Mobius for being an example for us in order to prove my point).

I gave an answer to the geographical location question. Sorry if you did not like the answer because it was the right one.

So now you have the power to see into my mind (interesting because God is the only One who can do that). But of course you think you know more than God anyway . . .

God speaks on the subject of words (just transmitting the message). God can change your foul mouth (He did so for me). I am glad that you are educated (why not speak like an educated person then?). Plus, it is not nice to walk out in public and have to explain to my daughter why people use such bad language or ask what does “explicit” mean Daddy? You want to swear, do it to yourself.

[Admin's note: The final two paragraphs of this comment constitute "preaching." These paragraphs are attempts to announce what "God" thinks or what "God" wants, as though there is no alternative viewpoint. In my opinion, such presentations are distracting to our discussions, which (though such comments might well be motivated by a commenter's religious beliefs) should be based on what commenter's themselves think. Such comments seem to invite an endless and unproductive back and forth focused on the authenticity of such claims. Further discussion of what is starkly presented as "God's" opinion, or any quotation to any passages from any religion's Sacred Literature, to the extent that those passages are intended to be unquestionable on any ground, are subject to pruning pursuant to the commenting guidelines regarding "preaching"].

In order to be truly informed on something one must do the ground work of study (claiming ignorance does not work with God). I studied the genealogies in context (cultural, historical, Biblical). Everybody has that same opportunity (especially today in the age of internet). The problem is most people do not want to do any work. They want to be spoon fed everything so they (like you) run to someone’s view on the topic, read it, and take it as “what the Bible says” without having the slightest clue what the Bible really says. Again, claiming ignorance does not work with God, especially in today’s age. Again, Doctor Luke (Gentile convert) was very well educated and knew how to research (he looked up the records/genealogies himself and wrote it out, allowing the readers to check his facts. For those who have not been gifted with education there are alternatives as well. There are others who have worked out the genealogy and again in the age of info it is not hard to find. Also, I am happy to help the “others” you refer to study the topic on their own. I see you are trying to shift the focus of the point once you cannot disprove what I wrote.

You have your beliefs and I respect that, even if they are wrong. Respect does not mean agreeing. I do not want to change you or try to convince you, that is God’s job. Plus, if I can talk you into Christianity then someone else can come and talk you out of it, therefore I share the message and allow God to do the convincing.

• Mike Pulcinella

As I have said, I have studied world religions. Once I began to study the Bible and became a follower of Jesus Christ I began to see the fallacies in religions. The best way to spot something fake is to study the real thing well. When I look at the core teachings of other religions I see the fake/false, man made elements that prove the religion to be false/man-made. Truth is exclusive, there is only one, so the rest cannot be right. When you look at the others compared to the Truth the mistakes become evident.

So, I am already settled on Christianity (Biblical Christianity) and while studying other religions I find that my choice was right.

I am glad that you are interested in people, so is God and so am I. I study culture (by living in the culture). I have noticed that just as the Bible says there is nothing new under the sun, people are the same everywhere you go (aspects of culture are different but the fundamentals are the same).

I do not have a façade, what you see is what you get. God wants us to be transparent and take off all of the different masks that we wear. He did that to me when I became a follower of Jesus Christ. I had a mask that I wore at school (language, actions, etc) and another mask for my parents and another for my friends and so on. I threw all of that junk away when I was born again.

I would love to discuss anything with you (that is descent of course) but I must advise you, I cannot be separated from the Bible. It is who I am (that is something that many on this site do not understand). The Bible leads every part of my daily life; the way that I think and speak, the actions that I take, the decisions that I make, the way I treat my wife and child. It is my existence. Here some would say “what would happen if we were to take away the Bible?”. Two things, It will never pass away (cease to be) and if I do not have a physical copy I have It hidden (stored) in my heart (memorized).

[Admin's note: These following portions of this comment constitute "preaching." These paragraphs are attempts to announce what "God" thinks or what "God" wants, as though there is no alternative viewpoint. In my opinion, such presentations are distracting to our discussions, which (though such comments might well be motivated by a commenter's religious beliefs) should be based on what commenter's themselves think. Such comments seem to invite an endless and unproductive back and forth focused on the authenticity of such claims. Further discussion of what is starkly presented as "God's" opinion, or any quotation to any religion's Sacred Literature to the extent that it is intended to be unquestionable on any ground, is subject to pruning pursuant to the commenting guidelines regarding "preaching"].

“so is God and so am I.”

“God wants us to be transparent and take off all of the different masks that we wear. He did that to me when I became a follower of Jesus Christ.”

One of the points of the scenario I described is that since the time those OT rules were laid down, we’ve developed the concept of statutory rape. We consider an adult male who has sex with a 14 year old to be a sex offender, regardless of how much force he used or how the girl reacted.
I think Erik would side with modern moral reasoning on these issues rather than rules created for a much different society. However, he can’t admit it, because to admit that he is using his own judgment rather than an ancient rule book would deprive him of the stick he thinks he can beat us up with.

Laudable attempt. The trouble is, this is a case of the Procrustean Bed. The bed, in this instance, is the Law, and people must be made to fit it, regardless of circumstance. No one heard the girl scream, therefore she was a willing participant and must die.

(Yes, Erik, I know that’s a simplification, but that’s what it boils down to.)

The question that gets lost in this is still, by what right does the girl get condemned in any instance? Consensual sex…well, those were the days when women were not people, they were chattel—property. If our property disobeys or does something you don’t like, you get rid of it.

I think early death was a bit more common in the OT than now, so stepparents were not uncommon - more often a stepmother though because of high maternal mortality. Anyway the actual relationship is not important. For stepfather, substitute uncle, cousin, family friend, even priest - an adult male in a position of trust. You also have a higher opinion of the sexual mores of OT times than seems warranted by all the bonking of concubines, handmaidens, etc that you read about - I know you say it wasn’t authorized by God, but it’s not clearly condemned either.

As you say, forensic methods were not very advanced in OT times, so even if you had a trial what evidence would there be? So let’s day you have a trial, and the girl testifies that she had sex with this adult male several times, and he didn’t physically restrain or gag her, but simply repeated his threat about the younger sister. She has no eyewitnesses, the assaults happened weeks ago so there is no evidence of bruising, etc. The adult male produces many character witnesses who testify how responsible and upstanding he is. What do you do?

And what about your reference to needing 2 eyewitnesses in a capital case? If that applies to this case, then there is no case. This is similar to shariah law, which requires the woman to produce 4 witnesses in a a rape case. Basically, there are no successful prosecutions for rape under shariah law.